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Getting ESA while waiting for appeal hearing

carol16carol16 Posts: 10Member Listener
Hi i had ESA taken away in dec 2016 due to having a capable work assessment in nov 16 the assessor gave me 0 points even though I have various health problems strokes in past ashtma rheumatism uncontrolled Diabetes depression and anxiety in his report he lied about everything saying he medically examined me which he didnt also what im supposed to have said to him I had a witness with me have gone through the MR stage am now waiting for the appeal to be heard as DWP agreed with his report ive been told i qualify for Reduced ESA Payments till my appeal is heard could someone tell me how long before the payments should start? Ive been told it can take up to 28 days before i receive anything I dont receive any other benefits except pip and am finding it very hard to cope im unable to claim JSA as im not fit for work.

Replies

  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Posts: 2,679Member Pioneering
    Hello carol16

    It is right that some people can claim ESA (assessment rate) pending an appeal decision.  

    It can take around 2-4 weeks for payments to come through. It can take this length of time as the Tribunal Service have to inform the DWP that you have correctly lodged an appeal e.g. the appeal was lodged within the time limit.  

    How do you know that the DWP have been told that you have lodged a correct appeal? Well, when you receive an appeal acknowledgment letter from the Tribunal Service, the DWP should receive this letter at a similar time.  It will of course take the DWP a few days to lodge this letter onto their system.

    Once there is  a note in the system that the appeal has been lodged and if a fit note has also been sent to the DWP, then the DWP can look into awarding ESA pending the tribunal's decision. So at this point you can start contacting the DWP and asking that ESA be awarded. 

    Kind regards

    maria

    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • carol16carol16 Posts: 10Member Listener
    Hi Maria thank you for your reply I received a letter from the tribunal service on the 22nd February 16 telling me they have received my request for appeal as i have problems talking on the phone my daughter in law called the DWP last week to ask when i would receive ESA at the reduced rate they said it could take upto 4 weeks for any money to be paid I was told prior to this by my local CAB that I should receive ESA within 2 weeks of receiving the letter from the Tribunal service thats why im a little confused.
  • JusticeJustice Posts: 206Member Pioneering
    Hi Carol,
       I hope that this is sorted out for you very soon. i do not have physical problems myself, but am a carer for my Husband who happens to have Parkinson's Disease. Why am I here on the Scope site you may wonder:-) well I had a very helpful conversation with a member of staff from the office today, I also used to work for Scope some years ago.

     I go through all the stress, and anxiety caused by these appeals, not only the appeals but the inefficiency, and the appalling attitude of the people from the DWP, and the assessors themselves. I have decided to write a book about the way the most vulnerable people in society are treated, despite the fact that we have a Disability Rights Act in force in this Country it seems that people are being discriminated against by the very organisations who profess to have their best interests at heart.

    I want real stories from real people. If any of you wish to tell me how you have been affected by these assessments, and how it has affected your carers and family then please send me a private message and I will elaborate.

    Anyone who agrees to let me use their story in the book can rest assured that names are changed, and any personal details kept in the strictest confidence.

    I must stress that I did ask permission this afternoon before going ahead and posting this. Thank You.
    Justice
  • carol16carol16 Posts: 10Member Listener
    Hello Justice Thank you, I hope it gets sorted soon to as im really struggling financially as im not claiming any benefit at the moment and am having to rely on family and friends to help me also its not helping with my anxiety and depression as im getting much worse with the stress of it all...I would be interested in telling you my story but i dont know how to send a private message on here perhaps you could tell me how kinds regards Carol
  • JusticeJustice Posts: 206Member Pioneering
    Hi Carol,
       Try to keep your chin up, not easy I know, but at least we have some sunshine today( Here at least), which always seems to make things a little less bleak.
    I am so pleased that you are interested in telling me your story with a view to including it in the Book.I cannot put my email address on an open forum, for one thing I don't think it is allowed. I am new here too so no idea how to do the private message thing, but I am trying to find out how to do that. Hopefully it wont take too long.
    Justice x
  • carol16carol16 Posts: 10Member Listener
    Hi Justice i am trying to cope best I can its been a lovely sunny day here too which was great when you find a way of sending private messages please let me know
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Posts: 2,679Member Pioneering
    Hi Carol

    I'm afraid there are often delays with this issue, as my colleague Maria described.

    If it has been an unreasonable delay and is affecting you in the way you suggest then you might like to consider complaining. You can do this via the gov.uk site here but this can in itself take a long time. You might like to visit your local MP as they sometimes get involved and can speed things up considerably.

    David
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • CandyflossCandyfloss Posts: 34Member Listener
    Hi Carol @ Justice.This reply concerns you both as I to am going through the same ,so try and find something to make u smile every day and remember each day takes u closer to a verdict good or bad ,at least you will be able to move forward Carol...When u find out how to process  private messages I too will be happy to add to your book Justice please keep me informed on your progress......
  • JusticeJustice Posts: 206Member Pioneering
    Hi @Candyfloss, thank you for the offer. The book is now finished and on Amazon Books. I can't advertise it here of course, Scope will provide a link with my next Blog though :-). No idea how to private message, not sure everyone has that ability active on here.

  • mellymoomellymoo Posts: 2Member Listener
    I've had no money for 7 wks now. How do u get some sort of payment til they decide my esa appeal which is the.5/03 a few wks yet I need. Help now so need a advance payment til then
  • maggietate000maggietate000 Posts: 6Member Listener
    Hi my claim is with the tribunal court and I'm waiting for a court date since Nov 2017 for ESA. I was wrongly advised and was told to go back on jsa 
    I see another coach as my one was on training she told me I should be there and said that I should be back on ESA pending appeal 
    Another certificate had to be sent in....done ...but when I phoned the lady said I would be on a lower rate she's passed it to the person who will be phoning me back to confirm is this right or should I be on the same amount before my appeal! I'm really confused 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    You get put on the assessment rate once you appeal and it should be automatic bar a couple of circumstances:

    1) If you've been found fit twice before.
    2) If you have claimed JSA in the period from your ESA stoppage up to appealing then you will have to make it clear you want to revert to assessment rate ESA as soon as you have appealed. You will also need up to date fit notes going forward up to and possibly a little beyond the date of your hearing. 
  • maggietate000maggietate000 Posts: 6Member Listener
    I have ostioarthritis in my thumb joint and dislocation of my thumb and being left handed makes it worse my surgeon has put me down for surgery 3 months waiting list my fit note is for 3 months ...ive also got ostioarthritis in my right hand starting ..im waiting for a date from the court ...just wondering if I get the normal rate 
  • maggietate000maggietate000 Posts: 6Member Listener
    How much is the assessment rate !
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    £73.10 if you’re over 25.
  • maggietate000maggietate000 Posts: 6Member Listener
    Same as jsa I was getting £146.20 fortnightly thank you for your help they was supposed to phone me back today but didn't so I've to wait till Mon now 
  • DBrooksDBrooks Posts: 3Member Listener
    Why is this allowed t happen, the costs alone for appeals and tribunals. My ESA went to tribunal the first time in April 2016, CAB at the time applied to the upper tribunal as there were errors of law found in the statement of reasons. Upper tribunals agreed and I went back for another tribunal hearing in June 2016. Rejected again and appeal rate ESA stopped.  Since then we have been round in circles again errors of law where found on the basis of assumptions and opinions and not actual facts, back to the Upper tribunals who agree for  another tribunal which I am currently waiting for  hearing date.  In all this time since June 2016 I've had nothing CAB advised i should get the appeal rate still but its not normally given so far into appeals..God only knows what I'll do if it gets rejected again in debt up to my eyeballs cant get JSA being unfit to work and my gp has been giving me sicknotes to cover me, cant get UC since my husband has a part time job.  
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    You claim JSA and can restrict your claimant commitment and also there’s scope for an extended period of sickness in there, albeit that a very recent sneaky change has made that a little difficult.
  • maggietate000maggietate000 Posts: 6Member Listener
    Great news received a phone call today from ESA they have excepted my claim and I will be getting the right amount up untill the court appeal date thank you for you advice x
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    Cb based esa finished in Feb had mandatory reconsideration and applied to tribunal court on 1st of September for court appeal. This was done and excepted in the allowed time and the court advised dwp. My wife works 32 hrs a week. Could someone tell me if I can get reduced rate benifit while awaiting court date as dwp say as it was cb based and not income based they will only pay my stamp is this true as I've had different replys in different forams.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    My assumption is that you’re arguing you should be in the Support Group as that’s the only argument for staying on contributory beyond 12 months. Whether or not you get assessment rate ESA in the appeal period depends on a number of things. It is based on the assessment rate used at the outset of your claim which is paid regardless of NI contributions or income so you ought to get it unless you’ve been previously found fit for work more than once.
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    Thanks for your comments. My medical evidence and gp all point to me being not fit for work. And I have only had 1 fit for work assessment that said I'm fit to work. When I spoke to the dwp they said I'm not entitled to it as I was on cb based esa. How would I go about making a case for point.
    Regards pigeon55.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    Well first of all have you actually appealed and secondly are you currently on JSA?
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    I haven't claimed jsa is i don't think I'm fit for work neither dose my GP who has recently given me another fit for work note for 6 months. I have gone through mandatory reconsideration and also appealed to hm courts wich was accepted and they notified dwp of this. This was dated September 17.
  • maggietate000maggietate000 Posts: 6Member Listener
    I've never been fit to work but the never listen to your doctor and they are NOT professional just assement based ...joke ...you are entitled to ESA pending appeal on basic rate until you court date with fit note don't take no for an answer. Good luck pigeon
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    Thanks for your time and replys much appreciated.
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    I've just spoken to the dwp on the phone again they talk to you like something on there shoe. They insist that because my cb based esa only runs for 365 days and mine finished on 7th Feb 2017 that even though I had acceptance by hm courts in September 2017 for my appeal I'm not entitled to  any esa payment or reduced payment only my stamp contribution to cover my old age pension. They say they going to put a letter in the post explains the reason for this event though I asked who I could appeal there dission to. I no what there letter of explanation will say before it gets hear. Your esa contribution has expired as it only runs for 365 days which they have already told me. Just wished I was able to return to work as this is only causing me hear you ache stress depression and anxiety. I can see why people do what they do after being involved with the dwp.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    Right. So what they’re saying is that because your wife works you can’t get means-tested ESA during the appeal period and you can’t get contributory ESA because that’s what your appealing about. Hmm.
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    It seams that way.I don't trust theme though because she said they had had no correspondence from me since last September and I no that's wrong as I spoke to them in February and they said my claim had been shut down as I had not sent in my fit for work notes and the courts send them a copy of all my medical evidence and so do I. When she looked again she said oh yes we have you fit for work note from Feb to Aug this year. They are the most unhelpful people I have ever had a telephone conversation with. They for get that the 40 yrs I've worked in contributed to there salary. Looking to make a different approach to them now and see what reply they come up with then. Once again thanks for your comments.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    Most likely you’re not telling to them but to an out-sourced call centre.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0 Pioneering
    Hello pigeon55

    I think that  it's probable that you can't be paid the assessment rate of ESA pending your appeal. This is because when you appeal about the support group of ESA, you are only paid the "lower rate"of ESA pending the appeal. In  the case of someone with a partner who works, the lower rate of ESA doesn't exist after 365 days - so that would mean that no ESA benefit is payable. (I'm looking at page 96 of Disability Rights UK's  "Disability Rights Handbook" 2017 to 2018, paragraph 19). 

    Does anyone agree or not agree with what I've written here (in this first paragraph)?

    You said that you've worked and paid contributions for 40 years. It is very frustrating that the ESA is restricted to being paid for only a year unless you are in the support group. It's also frustrating that the DWP have spoken to you inappropriately, and that no-one there has been able to explain the rules to you. 

    This is an issue that affects a lot of people and may be something that some politicians, and certainly members of the public are unaware of. Talking to your MP may be a way of creating more awareness. 

    Best wishes

    Gill_Scope
    Finance and Benefits Specialist
    Scope Helpline 
    Tel: 0808 800 3333 
  • tommtomm Posts: 173Member Pioneering
    DBrooks said:
    Why is this allowed t happen, the costs alone for appeals and tribunals. My ESA went to tribunal the first time in April 2016, CAB at the time applied to the upper tribunal as there were errors of law found in the statement of reasons. Upper tribunals agreed and I went back for another tribunal hearing in June 2016. Rejected again and appeal rate ESA stopped.  Since then we have been round in circles again errors of law where found on the basis of assumptions and opinions and not actual facts, back to the Upper tribunals who agree for  another tribunal which I am currently waiting for  hearing date.  In all this time since June 2016 I've had nothing CAB advised i should get the appeal rate still but its not normally given so far into appeals..God only knows what I'll do if it gets rejected again in debt up to my eyeballs cant get JSA being unfit to work and my gp has been giving me sicknotes to cover me, cant get UC since my husband has a part time job.  
    I would say that you should be paid ESA for some parts of that period, IE following the UT organising a new hearing  upto the date the DWP stop payment, for each hearing , but the time from the DWP stop payment until the UT has notified you of a new ftt hearing  ESA isn't payable , 
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    In all sense looking at my problem. They stoped my £109 esa cb based in 2017 saying I'm fit for work. In my opinion and my medical people say I'm not fit to work. Surely as they say I'm fit for work commonsense says they should pay job seekers durring this period. I would be contraddicting myself if I claimed jsa as I'm the one who is not fit for work.
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Posts: 109Member Connected
    Just been looking at my payments during my esa period I started off at around £74 per week then it went up to £109 per week. Also if you are in the Wrag group shouldn't you have to go for regular work related interviews. In the time I was receiving cb based esa I only was invited to the job center once in 12 months seams a bit strange to me as they also allowed my file to become dormant and it was closed down separate last year seams they getting my case very mixed up its realy confussing me. Been offered help with my case on a no win no fee basis anyone used something like these before.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    pigeon55 said:
    In all sense looking at my problem. They stoped my £109 esa cb based in 2017 saying I'm fit for work. In my opinion and my medical people say I'm not fit to work. Surely as they say I'm fit for work commonsense says they should pay job seekers durring this period. I would be contraddicting myself if I claimed jsa as I'm the one who is not fit for work.
    There’s a lot of over-thinking going on. If your ESA hs ceased then your choice is JSA. There’s no contradiction. It’s pefectly possible to claim JSA and then claim an extended period of sickness. Even if you couldn’t do the latter JSA are generally not looking to focus on ESA claimants who are found fit unless you’re wholly unco-operative.
  • tommtomm Posts: 173Member Pioneering
    JSA are generally not looking to focus on ESA claimants who are found fit unless you’re wholly unco-operative

    Milage does vary on that mike,  i found that knowing the rules surrounding JSA ,ie what is mandatory and what isn't  can be of a big help regarding the claimant commitment,UJM account, ect, because once some of these so called work coaches know that you are aware of the rules ect, they back off

  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    True but largely irrelevant if you get an EPS. Nowadays we rarely have people who lose ESA and then manage to somehow screw up JSA.
  • tommtomm Posts: 173Member Pioneering
    edited April 2018
    The 1st  appeal for me, i ended up getting sanctioned whilst i was claiming JSA whilst waiting for the MR, it took them around 9 weeks,But i don't think EPS was available back then (2014) iicr, 4 weeks sanction , for failing to sign on or late signing , I still got paid for that period once i got ESA restarted again though,
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    Yes, you would. Specifically because it was an FTA rather than a found fit. The rules are different.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0 Pioneering
    What is EPS please?

    Gill_Scope
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,492Member - under moderation Disability Gamechanger
    Extended period of sickness. A period of sickness you can have whilst on JSA.
  • kamara46kamara46 Posts: 1Member Listener
    I had a letter telling me how much esa I will get, the letter is dated 16th April, I have my assessment on 21st May, yet I have received no money yet, how long does it take, or should I phone them up, I don't have any money left out of my savings now for food, bills etc
  • needhelp2018needhelp2018 Posts: 1Member Listener
    Hi i recived a letter yesterday stating iam no longer alowed esa even though i had 2 major operations last year to remove a condrosrcoma (cancer) from my leg and i still in really bad pain and also still need walking aids for short distances or wheelchair for anything longer than 20 metres i also suffer from diabeates (type1) and depression can anyone help and tell me the best course of action to take please 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 14,930Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    Hi i recived a letter yesterday stating iam no longer alowed esa even though i had 2 major operations last year to remove a condrosrcoma (cancer) from my leg and i still in really bad pain and also still need walking aids for short distances or wheelchair for anything longer than 20 metres i also suffer from diabeates (type1) and depression can anyone help and tell me the best course of action to take please 
    Hi,
    Were you found fit for work after a face 2 face assessment? If so then your next step is a Mandatory Reconsideration (MR) and you have 28 days to request this. You should put it in writing stating which group you think you should be placed into and your reasons why. Did you send in evidence to support your claim and were you previously in a group or on assessment rate?

    As your money has now stopped, were you claiming Income Related or Contributions based? If it was Income related then you need to check what's in your area, if it's a full Universal credit area then you won't be able to claim JSA for extended period of sickness. You will have to claim UC, if you claim UC then you won't be able to go back onto assessment rate of ESA. Check your area here.

  • Netty10Netty10 Posts: 6Member Listener
    I’ve been told today after esa assessment I have no points and to claim uc. Tried to and because I have had a disability premium on my esa I am not allowed to claim uc. Am at a total loss as to what to do now. Someone suggested I claim income support as I am classed as my sons Carer. Is this my best course of action whilst I ask for a reconsideration?
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 14,930Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    Netty10 said:
    I’ve been told today after esa assessment I have no points and to claim uc. Tried to and because I have had a disability premium on my esa I am not allowed to claim uc. Am at a total loss as to what to do now. Someone suggested I claim income support as I am classed as my sons Carer. Is this my best course of action whilst I ask for a reconsideration?
    Hi,


    Or if you claim carers allowance for looking after your son then yes you can claim Income support.

  • eric144eric144 Posts: 12Member Listener
    I received two letters yesterday.

    One telling me they have received my ESA appeal, the other a UC50 form for another WCA. I was told to claim UC while my appeal process was ongoing.

    I don't want to be in the ludicrous situation of winning the appeal and failing the WCA. Can I switch back to ESA now my appeal is officially in the system ?

    Thank you !!!
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 14,930Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    eric144 said:
    I received two letters yesterday.

    One telling me they have received my ESA appeal, the other a UC50 form for another WCA. I was told to claim UC while my appeal process was ongoing.

    I don't want to be in the ludicrous situation of winning the appeal and failing the WCA. Can I switch back to ESA now my appeal is officially in the system ?

    Thank you !!!
    Hi,

    It would have been better to have started your own thread with your question because it causes so much confusion when asking questions on other peoples threads.

    As you claimed UC then you can't go back onto ESA because ESA no  longer exists for you now.  You will need to fill out the UC50 form and return it, with your evidence no later than the date in the letter.

    Any decision made on the new work capability assessment will overrule the Tribunal decision.
  • BenistmonkBenistmonk Posts: 326Member Pioneering
    When my ESA was stopped, I was advised by 3 different people over the phone from the Citizens Advice Bureau to claim UC, they even said they had done some dubious calculation to persuade me, saying I would be better off on UC.

    Of course I knew it was bad advice and politely declined. 


  • eric144eric144 Posts: 12Member Listener
    eric144 said:
    I received two letters yesterday.

    One telling me they have received my ESA appeal, the other a UC50 form for another WCA. I was told to claim UC while my appeal process was ongoing.

    I don't want to be in the ludicrous situation of winning the appeal and failing the WCA. Can I switch back to ESA now my appeal is officially in the system ?

    Thank you !!!
    Hi,

    It would have been better to have started your own thread with your question because it causes so much confusion when asking questions on other peoples threads.

    As you claimed UC then you can't go back onto ESA because ESA no  longer exists for you now.  You will need to fill out the UC50 form and return it, with your evidence no later than the date in the letter.

    Any decision made on the new work capability assessment will overrule the Tribunal decision.
    Sorry, I didn't know what to do for the best. Thanks for your help. I really appreciate it.

    I  was told to apply for UC on page 3 of the decision letter telling me I had 'failed' the WCA.   This is very hostile system.                                                                     
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