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Overweight

TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
I am not trying to insult anyone with this, I really am curious about it. Hopefully people won't take it the wrong way.

I have been watching a number of documentary type programs recently, mostly those related to the health services and the police. I have also spent a lot of time on an older age group Social Network site. All of this has shown me some interesting and avoidable issues linked to being overweight (not necessarily obesity, just overweight).

The majority of people are not happy with being overweight, this seems to be fairly universal and more people than ever suffer bullying based on their weight. There is a much greater risk of developing some conditions and even disabilities which are much more likely in people who are overweight. Conditions like Diabetes, high BP and heart problems are well known but less well known is that certain cancers, strokes, some kidney problems and some musclulosketal problems are also more likely. There are also additional issues such as breathing problems, snoring, joint and back pain, tiredness and difficulties doing exercise and these often lead to isolation in obesity cases. In discussions about such things people always reel off the same reasons for their situation but really most of them seem to be excuses. Society as a whole has an obsession with the consumption of food and drink and, I guess, people do not want to be singled out for ridicule by friends who are probably in exactly the same situation but deflect it by picking on others.

I used to be very slim as a teenager but through both of my marriages I gained weight. Even after I began living alone I still continued to gain weight until I became obese (or at least borderline so). I did have one advantage though as I was above average height and have a very broad skeleton so the weight never looked as bad as it would on many others. I weighed, at my largest, 23.5 stone (146,25 Kg). However, due to my skeletal structure, I looked quite "scary" as my son's girlfriends referred to me, lol! As time went by and my difficulties with both eating and preparing meals gradually became more difficult I found myself eating the same sort of bad diet I always have but much less of it. I must admit though that now I have lost considerable weight I much prefer my slimmer figure even though I was never actually unhappy with myself in any way. I suppose I was fortunate in a way that my condition was not exacerbated by my weight and the loss has made no difference to it. I now weigh 14 stone (87.1 KG) and supposedly look much better for it.

What I do not understand though is why so many people are unhappy with their weight and yet continue to eat and drink exactly as they always have which can only lead to more unhappiness, illness and problems. I know that some do have real problems with keeping their weight down but that doesn't really apply to most as the % of such people hasn't changed dramatically but overweight and obesity has risen and is still rising quickly. Something like 25% of adults in this country are obese and 20% of children (aged 10-11) are also obese. The figures for overweight are vastly larger.

Maybe people consider me as lucky to have lost the weight and maybe I was but I have never given up anything I liked eating except for a few things I can no longer manage due to having to use dentures. I have also eaten a diet that would frighten anyone who gives dietary advice, lol! For example... apart from a few Chinese vegetables I haven't eaten vegetables since I was 6. I have always eaten a large proportion of fried food and such things as pizza, curry and chilli. I always cooked using oil and always eat white bread and full fat dairy products and always eaten more than my fair share of cakes, sweets and biscuits. I still eat all these things, just less of them. People really do not have to eat healthier necessarily just make sure to eat less. It is easily possible to gain weight on a supposedly healthy diet if you eat too much of it.

I expect there will be a fair number that will mention diets due to illness but surely the same reasoning can apply and, with weight loss, people should become healthier anyway. The oddest thing of all though is the large proportion of people suffering diabetes who still insist on over-eating. I know my uncle suffered from it and he was the same, always eating things he shouldn't and always too much of it'

How much, do you think, is actual inability to lose weight compared to peer pressure? I think peer pressure is positively the worst factor of all in the increase of weight on people.

TK
I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.

Replies

  • fishingmumfishingmum Posts: 565Member Chatterbox
    I know someone with a thyroid problem and she is on a special diet from the doctor but the weight loss is very slow, some weeks nothing coming off at all, my mother in law when she was alive was due to the steroids she was on and no matter what she tried she could not lose weight at all.

    I knew a girl who was diabetic and she could not put weight on, she was in hospital on drips and tube feeding whilst still eating huge amounts and could not gain weight, so there are plenty of people who have genuine medical reasons.

    But the most important one that is often missed is mental health reasons.
    Just because someone knows what they eat is making them fat does not mean they will give it up, it can be a security blanket, the amount of people who are fussy eaters (my son is autistic and has a total of 14 foods he will eat) People may not know how to cook different foods and do not have the resources to find out. It is often cheaper to buy unhealthy foods than what it is healthier options when you do not know how to make a meal.

    As for losing weight and peer pressure, I think peer pressure would encourage people to lose weight rather than to keep it on, lets face it, you can not go diving or fishing, mountain climbing or canoeing with friends if you are physically unable, so therefore peer pressure would encourage you to lose weight. I think it is more what is going on inside someones head rather than any external pressure from friends keeping weight on.

    Another thing to look at is how we as a society have come to being more sedentary in our lives, look at how we communicate, how we socialise, how we find out information. Instead of being encouraged to go out and play, children sit in front of a computer or mobile phone, instead of walking to the library to get a book we download it online, instead of meeting up with friends outside we communicate over social media, even jobs now require you to spend more time on a computer typing to fill out paperwork. There are many factors involved, but glad to hear you were able to lose the weight :)


    life is too short to let others make you miserable.
  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    @fishingmum, the oddest thing is that I never wanted to lose the weight, I was quite happy the way I was. It was only once I regained (well almost) my old shape and size that I appreciated it.

    I know there is a big movement to try to keep weight down but only in superficial ways. People still want to have their take-aways and their meals out, thay just want to lose weight too. When I was young we ate out only on holidays and there was no such thing as take-aways and it was only when such things became popular that I began to gain weight. Now everyone expects to eat and drink to excess with their friends because that has become normal living and that is what I meant by peer pressure. People can get away with this for a while but not for the years and years that people now indulge. I think that there needs to be a general acceptance that we just cannot live this way before things will change. There seems to be also a mass misconception that a little exercise will overcome a massive over intake of things. It may help a little but there is no way to overcome a mass intake without reducing that intake.

    I do accept that some have problems, genuine problems with keeping weight down or up but too many people do use it as an excuse for the reasons I have stated. It can be very difficult to be different and not join in especially as some will literally attack others they see as trying to do something about it rather than admit that they are actually jealous that they do not have the strength to try themselves. I do wonder if the majority of people, if they really understood the harm they do to themselves, would try harder to abstain rather than join in.

    Is it ignorance that prevents them or do they know but not want to know?

    I think we are all allowed one vice, mine is smoking, but I simply do not understand why people make themselves unhappy. Is this the way people are now? Are we only happy when we have something to complain about?

    In a way I am glad that I am old and I feel sorry for my children when I see them having problems due to basically other people's perception of them. I suppose that's what Social Networking promotes, a way for people to criticise others anonymously and a paranoia of wanting to be seen as "nice".

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • fishingmumfishingmum Posts: 565Member Chatterbox
    take aways in one form or another have been about for hundreds of years, people could not afford to be lazy when making meals as the amount of "spare" cash was a lot less. disposable income is more of a recent thing for those not lucky enough to have been born with a silver spoon in their mouth. if you look at what is classed as needed to live now, we can add in internet access, socialisation amounts, etc all deemed necessary for modern day living.

    In the 60's when eating out became more popular for working and middle class and take aways became more than just a treat once a month, the shift had started. The more technological improvements came along the more people demanded by way of living, therefore less time needed to prepare and make food. The more 2 parents had to be out of the house to pay for modern day living standards, the more take aways became a viable option to live by, then further ready meals in shops for when take aways were just a bit too expensive on a daily basis. Apathy seeped in slowly when it came to food, with younger generations feeling more of the outcomes than older generations due to the lifestyle they were now used to.

    As you said yourself you were happy, you did not want to lose wieght it was only when you did you realised, that could be said for a lot of people, not realising, not thinking about it, maybe unaware entirely as their peers are the same, so overall that gives more reasons to why it occurs.

    I have never seen anything that states a little exercise will overcome obesity, nor do I personally know of anyone who would think that, maybe its a town thing.
    Most people I know are not overweight, the few I do are down to health problems and their constant struggle to lose it. I am also amazed at the fitness levels of these same people as they are extremely active but between medication and their conditions make it extremely difficult for them.

    I do not feel sorry for my children at all, they are active have a healthy attitude towards food, do not over indulge (well Christmas and Birthdays are the exception)

    I do think there is a lack of awareness in the general population. In schools they no longer do proper cooking classes but children should be taught first at home and it should not be down to a government body to show them. The same with exercise, if children are not shown at home first then the idea is alien to them by the time they get to school, so while we like to blame other generations, the truth is it lies at our own doorstep and the problem is ours to solve and do something about now.
    life is too short to let others make you miserable.
  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    I was a teenager in the 70's and I think the first take-away I ever had was at age 36. Prior to 1970 I lived in London and no one in the street had take-aways except for fish & chips as there were no places to get them from and even those were never more than once a week. The street was very long, we lived about half-way along at number 153. After 1970 we lived in a town of around 100,000 or so and it was only during that decade that burger places began to appear and some people used to have chinese or indian meals but mostly restaurant style but still sparingly done. My friends and I, when visiting each other, had home cooked meals almost without exception. I left home at 20 and my wife and I had disputes about them as she came from a rather well-off family, at least compared to mine.

    I have never lived "out-of-town" but would expect a healthier lifestyle to be lived there but for the last 30 or so years the average size per person has risen alarmingly which can be seen just by walking down the high street in my town and almost any street in London. Admittedly I haven't been to London for about 15 years.

    Another factor that applies more to city life is the appalling preponderance of multi-car families and people never walking, even to go to a shop down the road (less than a quarter mile). My father never had a car at all until he was in his mid-30's but my generation insisted on them at 17 or 18. Mum and I used to walk everywhere or use a bus if it was a long way away.

    I have heard many people justify exercise as a very large factor is losing weight (which it is not) which is more a head-in-the-sand idea.

    A few years ago I had a female cleaner of 35 coming in to help me out and she and her 6 year old ate nothing but frozen meals. She was astounded to see me cooking as she did not know how. I hope I have brought up my own children better than that but unfortunately society as a whole seems not to bother with such things. My son (23) recently left a house share with 5 of his friends as he was the only one who could cook and he got fed up with being expected to cook whenever the others couldn't afford a take-away. He now shares with another lad who can cook.

    I'm afraid I disagree with a lot of what people class as necessary now. People have been generally spoilt since the 60's and 70's. All that seems to have really happened is that the gulf between the have's and have-not's has widened dramatically. Another trend I disagree with is that when I was younger parents always tried to leave something for their children after they died if they possibly could. Now they try to use every penny they can on themselves leaving little, if anything, for their children. My mum used to worry constantly about spending money on herself as it would mean less for me and my sister when she died and one of my reasons for not sticking around is that it would mean more (in monetary terms) for my children when I'm gone rather than having used it all up on myself.

    Society is very self-centred now, at least in the towns and cities.

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Posts: 2,247Member Brian Blessed
    When you start taking some medication you should be made aware that they can slow your metabolism or make you drowsy so it would make sense to offer weight management or healthy eating advice or sessions alongside. In an ideal world gp s would offer things like yoga and tai chi for free in the bigger health centres or point you to community centres offering cheaper classes. It would save a fortune long term. 


    I am a fibrowarrior!
  • magunra2kmagunra2k Posts: 41Member Whisperer
    Weight gain and loss is more than just about calories in and out, many different factors affect how heavy someone is and how big they are, I am extremely heavy for my height and my BMI would put me close to morbidly obese , but as my GP said, you clearly are not ,you could lose a couple of stone but you are very muscular and even after losing a load of weight, my chest was still 50inch and my neck 19.5 and thighs 26 inch with very little fat on them, i guess i missed my calling as a Rugby player. 
    I have found that our bodies betray us when it comes to diet, eating less isn't enough for me to lose weight consistently, as my body would very quickly adapt to a reduction in calories, My wife and i were shocked how quickly our weight loss went in to plateau this February, we made steady loss of 2 to 3 pounds a week for about 4 to 5 weeks, then after those weeks it became extremely difficult to lose anymore, we increased our activity,included more walking and bought a step machine, but even with those our weight froze at about 2 stone lost after 4 months,bearing in mind i was looking to lose about 4 stone . We started to look for advice on how to continue to lose weight, from fasting to smaller more frequent meals,more fluid,no caffeine, smaller plates,eating certain foods. basically we have tried loads of different things but essentially it seems very difficult to get past a certain weight without just not eating anything. 

    Then i got ill with Kidney stones and had to have an operation and now i am currently dropping weight at a very steady rate, but this seems to be related to the antibiotics im taking or because of the stent located in my kidney, my body seems to be "dealing" with my food far more efficiently if you follow my meaning,what goes in passes in less than 24 hours compared to 36 to 48 before the operation and medication, almost as though because the food is inside me for less time my body is having to use the fat i have stored? i dont know for certain the reason but im still eating mainly protein and vegetables/fruit as i was before and the effect the diet should have been having is once again happening.   

    Obviously im not advocating people go out and get kidney stones and have to have an operation and or antibiotics for a prolonged period , but i am left wondering if in some way either the kidney stones were in someway interfering with weight loss or that the days not eating surrounding my operation in some way reset my bowel functions or that the drugs/stent in some way are affecting my metabolism in some fashion.  
  • bevt2017bevt2017 Posts: 340Member Chatterbox
    Hi @Topkitten

    Well done for loosing the weight!

    But In my case, food has absolutely nothing to do with my weight gain.

    I'm 6 foot 2 and have always been skinny (Size 10). No matter what I ate I never put on any weight. 

    When I was at school, i was always called "olive" from the cartoon popye. They use to say things like, put your arms out bev when you walk over that grid, you might fall in and other names that still effect me even today.

    I first started to gain weight, just after Xmas 2017. Everyone would say well your not active like you use to be. Well why all of a suden I've not been active for 2 years?.
    Then I found out through a blood test, I had early menopause
    They started me on HRT and I still didn't loose any weight. My doctor then put me on a stronger HRT and within a week I went from a size 14 to a size16.
    I'm still trying to find the right HRT for me.

    Is it the menopause? Or the HRT?
    No one can tell me.
    I don't eat a lot, so it's nothing to do with food.
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Posts: 2,247Member Brian Blessed
    Apparently unhealthy bacteria in our digestive system or gut can cause all sorts of imbalances and fluctuations with our weight and the way we process food. It appears that this could be down to in some part to eating fast foods and ready meals. Apparently if we all cooked from scratch and knew what we put into our foods then we would all be more healthy! Who knew? Excuse the sarcastic humour but some of us cannot cook from scratch and lots of healthier options are more expensive. So when some of us choose cheaper less healthy ready meals it’d out of necessity. I can’t cook unsupervised. It’s easier to eat less fruit and veg when you have i b s and can’t cope with them if you want to keep all your fingers. I like solutions to problems. Please tell me how do I buy prepare anc cook cheaper healthier safer options that fit in with my own health requirements please? 


    I am a fibrowarrior!
  • fishingmumfishingmum Posts: 565Member Chatterbox
    @debbiedo49 have you kept a food diary? My mother and grandmother had ibs, but in the 80's it was found out my grandmother had crohns disease, she kept a food diary and things like bread pasta and rice used to make it worse for her, she ended up on a limited diet mostly fish and nuts, beans and pulses she had a lot less episodes but it affected her till she died, My mother cut out white bread pasta and rice and moved over to whole meal but over all eat less of those items and it helped. Certain fruit and veg made it worse for her as well.

    Have you spoken to a nutritionist at all, or has your doctor given you a list of foods to avoid, anything you know personally that triggers your ibs? all these are factors as well as any medications you are on, but it is workable, and I am sure there will be a way for you.

    @Topkitten My dad was working in hotels and restaurants in the 60's doing take away food in Glasgow and in the late 60's was working in London for a while before coming back to Glasgow, he said himself it was late 60's it really picked up and more and more people were eating out and getting takeaways, He opened up his own restaurants and had a couple fo take way places, The money made from the take away places was a lot more than the restaurants. It is a big industry, I mind making about 150-200 pizzas a night come Thursday Friday and Saturday, never mind the pasta dishes that were sent out. The rest of the week it was not as much, but still a lot. My Dad used to have a few customers who would want food not on the menu, mostly elderly people who struggled to cook, maybe an omlette or tripe, or liver and onions, my dad always made a point of making it for them and the guys would deliver on their way round for normal deliveries, so it did not cost extra, but once again it shows how we have changed as a society when it would not be considered if it does not have a profit attached to it.

    Society is very self centred, So if you can a little thing goes a long way, delivering free fish to a few neighbours, dropping in firewood to folk who do not have much money or means to get it for themselves, putting bins out for elderly neighbours, cooking an extra meal and passing it over the fence to a neighbour who has bad arthritis, I think we should do it, but I hear of it less and less.
    life is too short to let others make you miserable.
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Posts: 2,247Member Brian Blessed
    @fishingmum no I’ve ever had any help with iibs. I have just eliminated some foods from my diet that I can’t tolerate.  Thanks for suggestions. 


    I am a fibrowarrior!
  • thespicemanthespiceman Posts: 2,695Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    edited July 11
    Hello every body thought I would like to explain my thoughts on this post.

    Understanding the way we all are the relationship between food and the way we eat.  It is a fascinating subject much debate.

    I have been on a personal crusade in my own life have got food qualifications in the sense. Have them to deal with my own battles and issues. Including Understanding Health part 2. Food science qualifications. Plus many others. So I suppose am a bit of food scholar.  In the past was going to degree course but illness and other personal issues prevented me from doing so.

    I admire the work of Dr Ian Marber The Food Doctor. Who is extremely worth looking up and reading his definitions of the way we eat and why we eat.

    May I first say why do we eat. For a number of reasons. Why are others seem unhappy eating.  Other put on weight and have weight issues.  A lot is due to the ongoing battle between the mind and the brain.

    We as a species need to eat but why are we all programmed to be like the way we all are. A lot of it is due to the food industry and how they have over the years perceived that the way is to be healthily is a certain profile.

    Other examples we know as we as a community can identify having a slim figure is the way and socially people are drawn to wanting this, yet many can not and will not but want to.  Causing depression and mental health concerns.

    We know as a society we are bombarded with subtle under lying messages every day. With out realising it. Look at me this morning on here and also switched on. First web page got health messages, webpages on new diets and why is that so. 

    Because the food industry realise that having a healthy body and mind equals money. There again why are similar messages sent regarding unhealthy food then. Again all the same issues.

    Look at the high street full of take- aways, and the rest.  Consider where they are put. Usually in areas of high poverty and places where the populations are very much of a density where communities gather.

    Look at the massive profits these companies make and how the marketing is used.  Understand that then you understand the way society is. Also always think of this. In my volunteer role I once had used to find funding for groups and well being support.  Who was willing to come up with the money.

    That's right the main food industries of these take away, fast food places. All willing to give money and in return promote there products in the group.  I used to order food and drink for the groups but was met with hostility if I ordered healthy choices. Tried to and was successful.  Yet discounts on the unhealthy was huge.

    Remember the fifties and sixties when cultures of countries was all too familiar in this country  Especially Italian and the introduction of Indian food. The plethora of cooking programmes.  All this is adding to peoples sub conscious what should I eat. 

    Now in this time. The bombardment and underlying current of looking at people health is such then and now. Every body is frightened and scared to eat and touch anything.  Gone are the attitudes of having what you want but it is being slowly eroded by the food industry . Whether on the TV or the media.

    So people are guided to choose the wrong thing and have been mislead constantly by certain factors in their life. To make health choices and to look at why and how to use what skills and talents they have. To be rewarded not cooking by Supermarkets. Look at this do not have to cook, we can help and advise.  Not realising that their subconscious is controlling them to make the wrong choices.

    Recent furore over labelling being one such crisis of the industry.

    Many books are out there promoting the relationship between mind and body.  When I was ill with addiction and eating.  The wrong things had to look at diet and why am I drawn to these fast food places. Understanding why and how.  Sent me to learn more and be educated.

    Part 2 of the way we eat and why others also have weight issues.  Is a bit more complex.  There are as members of our community have stressed illness and other mental problems can cause weight issues.  There factors such as genetics and may I add certain conditions.

    Also may I add my voice to that I am one. Having mental illness can and does effect you eating.  By the way taking of medication and other drugs can balloon weight.

    So how do we as community try to stop the erosion of eating the wrong things. Given time I use a bowl in Italy and other countries they use bowls. Like Pasta bowls which control portion sizes. Also eat with your eyes not with your stomach. This takes a while to do.

    Also remember the gland in your body called the Pituary Gland programmes your mind to eat again after twenty minutes, through scientific study and books.

    So have a glass of water first. Have if you can your main meal in a bowl.  Have and eat slowly. If you rush your food the body and brain do not communicate.  So eat slowly. Take your time.  Then rest.  After twenty minutes eating should feel full. Then have a pud or sweet but something a suggestion like yoghurt or fresh fruit.

    In certain countries the Med diet is the norm but even there now children are being diagnosed with obesity.  Understanding that the causes have and has been much arguments and interesting debates, ongoing.

    Please can I add that some people say look at me . Great never put on weight eat all this junk food and can smoke, drink and eat all I want. Well a lot of the weight is not showing but you forget. You can have fat growing inside your body.  Believe me been there. Seen my own body scan.

    Had to change. Also have and now still wish to and would if I can suggest any body who wishes to .  See how I can help..

    I hope I have laid any questions to rest. With sensitivity and respect.  Any body wishes to reply. Love to hear your comments with pleasure. All I can say been doing this a long time and do know the issues.

    Thank you all for reading this.

    Always 

    @thespiceman


  • susan48susan48 Posts: 2,065Member Brian Blessed
    Thank you @thespiceman, that post was very informative.


  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Posts: 2,247Member Brian Blessed
    Thanks spicy!


    I am a fibrowarrior!
  • thespicemanthespiceman Posts: 2,695Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    Hello every body thanks for kind comments. Now discussed that. Thought talk about the dreaded F word . Fats. Every body thinks fats are unhealthy the enemy of the food world.

    That is put about by the Food Industry I am afraid. We need fats and not all fats are unhealthy.  Certain types are harmful and others are vital for preventable of diseases.

    Fish oils ,including oily fish plus vegetable oils such as Olive oil and full fat dairy products. Between them supply the vitamins and the vitals ones we need.  Vitamins A , D, E.

    I will explain in simple terms if I can. Some differences and what is considered harmful and useful. 

    Split into several groups.  Start with the ones that are considered unhealthy.

    Saturated Fats include Butter, Hard Cheese, Palm and Coconut Oil, and fatty meat products.

    Transfats.  These are manufactured by the food industry known as Hydronised oils.  Usually found in cakes and biscuits.  Plus pies.  Used to prevent products going rancid.

    Fats that are considered healthy.

    Monounsaturated Fats. Sources are Veg oils such as Olive, Rapeseed, foods like Nuts, Avocados,

    With all Nuts and Avocados eat in moderation.

    Polyunsaturated Fats including Vegetable oils and Fish oils.  This is split into two groups.  Which many of you may have heard of Omega 3 and 6.

    Omega 6  sources are Olive oil and Sunflower oil and Omega 3 some of you have heard about is derived from Oily Fish, Soya Bean and Rapeseed Oil, Walnuts, Oily Fish your Mackerel, Salmon, Sardines.

    As with all fats eat in moderation.  These can be useful for heart health and other conditions.

    As with any health conditions and any health issues around dietary needs. Please consult a dietician, nutritionist or your Doctor.

    Obviously restrict yourself on saturated and transfats. why are these harmful.  Because the studies show and evidence also says that .

    Also there are many misconceptions around any fats.  Understanding any of this is all down to the advice we have been given by Governments, who want us all to be fit and healthy.

    A fit working population makes a better economy so makes more money for the country.  Remember as we have seen in our own community. Illness and disability is causing the Government and successive ones to rethink their policies.

    Hope that answers any questions. A lot of this is common sense and being practical and sensible.

    Hope any of this helps.

    Anybody wants to know more quite happy if I can answer any thing you wish to. Not medical advice of course not allowed to under SCOPE rules.  This is just I thought some ideas and useful information. People of our community should be aware of.

    Knowledge is the key.  Learning and been educated is a solution. I found for after my own health issues need to know.

    @thespiceman
  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    If you look into the past at my Mum and Dad's generation a lot of the time rationing was in place due to the war and, although the war ended in 1946, rationing continued until 1954. It was after that that overeating began because suddenly people could. During the war though and afterwards people ate mostly foodstuffs that people are now told to avoid. Things such as white bread, butter or margarine, fatty meat, etc. These things did not cause the weight problems then because people couldn't eat much of them.... that came later.

    In my case, and many others, simple reduction of food amounts and, more importantly, alcohol at normal meal times is sufficient to maintain a healthy weight (or at least what now passes for healthy). Of course being on medication that precluded completely any alcohol helped me a lot, not that I had ever drunk a lot, because it took away the temptation. Excessively alcohol is worse for weight than excessive food but mostly now people do both to excess without even realising what is too much.

    It is always much harder though when all your friends are over eating and over drinking and encouraging you to do the same. I have heard some people say "Well, I just end up hungry and eat other things like cakes, biscuits or sweets". Their is nothing wrong with being hungry for a while as the body will soon adapt to receiving less and then the temptation disappears. An example of this is that I used to eat a large pizza and then a cake or something afterwards. Now I can only manage 3/4 of a small pizza before feeling stuffed and then wait an hour or so before having a cake or something. I stick the rest of the pizza into the microwave for lunch next day.

    I eat nothing I didn't use to and very little healthy (not even vegetables of which I eat none at all) I just simply eat about half what I used to and now I don't even want to snack as much. In fact it has become such a habit that if I forget and miss a meal I don't notice it, lol! In no way did I reduce that amount in one go, just gradually needed less as I can barely get about and therefore need little anyway. Nor did I lose weight consistently, on at least 3 occasions my weight stabilised for 6 months or more before dropping further. In total it took around 7 years losing about a stone and a half a year. Now though I am stable despite still looking fairly large and weighing more than GP's say I am supposed to but I have a broad frame and heavy bones so will always look on the large size and weigh 2 stone more than I should.

    My second wife was into dieting but would bloat between diets so I did at times diet with her but that was during my gradual increase rather than the recent drop. I think, if people could resist the hunger pangs, they would find it easier to drop weight. Mind you I have to admit to not having a great deal of success myself unless I simply couldn't face causing the pain I suffer so decided hunger was better, lol!

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • GainaGaina Posts: 133Member Chatterbox
    edited July 12
    I'm prone to being slightly overweight (I am at the moment, long story involving pressure sores on my feet which meant it hampered with my exercise routine for 2 years).

    I trained for a charity Handcycle and kept a food diary to see where I was calorie - wise. It actually turned out I needed to up my calories!  I combined an exercise program  from https://www.nchpad.org/ with a cycling programme and I lost fat and gained muscle over the course of about 9 months.

    My motivation was more about being fit that losing weight, so that kept me on track.  I can highly recommend hand cycling to anyone who loves their grub as it's the only exercise that burns calories for up to 24 hours after your ride, so the more you ride, the more you can eat! 😁
  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    lol @Gaina, the more you can eat comment was a nice touch. :smile:

    I spent most of my first 49 years trying to keep my fitness up. At age 40 it was very good and I had a heart rate of 36-40. I fainted at football training once and, due to my overweight, they assumed heart attack and once they got me to A&E the machines kept setting off alarms that I was dead because they started setting it high. By the 5th time they were most nonchalant about resetting them as they began to understand their wrong assumption. Turned out I had an Arrhythmia which I have had since birth and the faint was when my heart stopped and restarted to reset itself to resolve the out-of-sequence pumping. Took them 6 months to figure it out though but they did find that for some odd reason and despite the high cholesterol diet my arteries simply didn't let the cholesterol attach and mine were as good as those of someone in their 20's. Just about everything about my body flies against all the sensible logic around and can do all sorts of strange things. Someday maybe I should make a list and carry it with me so that when people tell me (especially doctors) how things should be I can show them that what my body does and what I tell them about it is actually true. Would save me trying to remember, lol!

    Of course, since age 49, my health has gone downhill progressively faster to my current state of hardly being able to walk. I think that is why my children stay away from me as much as possible, they cannot stand to see their dad suffering so much and to not be what I really should be. That's why they were all there for me when I was in a coma but hardly see them now.

    There I go again going off-piste even on my own thread, lol!

    I think the main reason I started this post was because I really would like to understand why people have so much trouble with weight and even seem to make themselves unhappy. Maybe it's accidental or maybe peer pressure but it just seems so avoidable. I don't use it so much now but I am on a Social Networking site for over 50's. There was a poll once that asked people what would be the one body characteristic they would change if they had the chance. Most of the initial responses were complaints that one option was missing so they grudgingly added it. The missing option was weight and, unlike all other options, is the only one people do have control over. Around 55% selected this option which is daft because weight is something that almost everyone can control. I know a lot of people do not agree with that but my own experience shows that hunger is a factor of stomach size and overfeeding increases it. However, if you continually underfeed it the size of the stomach will shrink and hunger will dissipate. If you aren't hungry you can avoid eating and drinking easily so long as you do not spend all your time eating with others around. Maybe most people do not agree with this particular statement but, for me certainly, it is true.... you can literally eat anything you like so long as you do not eat more than you need (health permitting). I was quite happy being overweight and the weight loss was accidental but the way it worked does explain some things, at least to me.

    I mentioned before that the weight loss was spread over 7 years or so. No diet or healthy eating was involved except for not drinking any alcohol at all due to potential medication problems. At least 3 times I went more than 6 months without losing anything and then would lose a stone or stone and a half in 4-8 weeks and this explains I think why so many people give up. As I wasn't trying to lose weight it never bothered me and, in fact, losing chunks like that did concern me a couple of times. I have now been stable(ish) for around 2 years, hovering between 13.5 and 14.5 stone though lately I think it may have started again as I stuck on 14.5 stone for over a year and now going down towards 13.5 again. My biggest problem though is having regular meal times and, if you want to lose weight, that is something you really need. Missing meals especially regularly (in a manner of speaking) is actually less likely to allow you to lose weight.

    Is it perhaps will power that people find hard to find? Or perhaps simply joining friends for meals too often that stops people losing weight? I just find it hard to accept that people who are unhappy about their size cannot really get it under their own control. I know that for most generally healthy people the biggest issue is most likely alcohol and the amounts my children have frightens me but then I figure that's mostly because I really have to force myself to drink any at all even though my current medication doesn't preclude it any longer. I do remember though that when I used to play for darts teams almost everyone connected could not understand why I would go to pubs regularly and never drink anything but Coca cola or Pepsi. I was often lightly pressured by them to drink at least something alcoholic.... almost like I was letting the team down, but I never did. That is what I refer to as peer pressure. I believe I made them uncomfortable because I wouldn't join in as almost all the team got pretty drunk every match except for the designated drivers and me, lol!

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • fishingmumfishingmum Posts: 565Member Chatterbox
    @thespiceman another thing, people used to have to shell their own nuts for example in which case people would eat less than if they are preshelled, people eat more. This is not just a laziness thing, it is a pschological aspect of eating most people are unaware of. Same goes with shellfish, if you buy mussels pre shelled you will consume more than in the shell and you physically have to peel it and eat it, it also means you take longer to eat it therefore less likely to over eat.
    I do think nutrion should be a basic subject at school as well, as not every adult is aware of food, calories, fats, vitamins etc
    life is too short to let others make you miserable.
  • thespicemanthespiceman Posts: 2,695Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    Hello @fishingmum Thank you for kind words but you are right. I believe we live in a world of convenience all packaged ready to eat and on the go.

    I know for own self is useful but all depends what sort of food it is. Like a lot of the frozen food but just not the premade meals and microwave stuff. Some of it like Baked Potatoes good for emergency and useful for having a Baked Potato instead of chips.  With a meal.

    . I know I have heard the siesta in a lot of Spain  . Certain times like lunch are like two hours plus. Whether this will happen We should have it here.

    Know from the Italian friends I used to have.  Long times over food especially lunch and evening meal means to them a social time.

    Which I miss. Understand the need to eat slowly and take your time.

    Had one time a desk job only half hour lunch . My digestion all upset and out of tune.  

    Not good as I am a  gent need my lunch and need to be eaten slowly. Too much stress no wonder. I was ill a lot.

    Speak soon
  • fishingmumfishingmum Posts: 565Member Chatterbox
    @thespiceman a lot of cultures have meal times a a social gathering and take hours over eating, I love Chinese culture for that as well. meal times for us are about an hour long, when we have extended family over it is upto 2 hours as more talking than eating goes on and pinching off of each others plate.

    Taking your time eating is a good thing, in this country and many like it, half hour meal times are designed for business to profit, not for your digestion or health, I think that is one of the reasons things like IBS have soared, the stress involved in quickly getting to somewhere to eat and then rush back for fear of losing a job causes so many problems and a lot of people it is with their digestive tract that they feel stress. I want the Spanish 2 hour lunch implemented here :)
    life is too short to let others make you miserable.
  • thespicemanthespiceman Posts: 2,695Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    Hello @fishingmum Thanks very much. Quite right I am always a stickler for eating slowly.

    Joined a lunch club people mainly gents. Some time a go. Had to leave it because all these lads getting there food and never to want to eat slowly rushing their food down and I am left high and dry. no one to talk to.

    Am still eating and there all gone a few words to each other not to me really.  Just vanished. All too familiar and me nice quiet lunch. Yet I felt so isolated.

    Went to TESCO for a bite with them and in a matter of minutes all gone. I am sat there as they have gone.   Saw one of the diners said to him what is the rush. Have no time to eat have things to do.

    There lies the problems.
  • edeneden Posts: 5Member Listener
    Hi I have always been over weight  grown up at my biggest I was a size  30
    It to me 4 yrs on my own to lose over 8st 
    That was 5 years ago
    I have kept the weight off 
    All I can say is my weight was me not caring about me 
    Feeling  that if the two people in this world who bring me into this world  can leave you at 3 years old  walk away from me 
    And end up in children's homes in Manchester were i was born only to be brought to northern Ireland when my dad was found when I was 7years old and his 2nd wife didn't want me so I ended up in homes here  
    Until I was 18years old when I got my flat 
    I was on my own 
    Why should I care for me or like me  when they could nt even love care or hold me 
    So yes I was unkind to myself 




  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    @eden. such a sad story but I feel it is too often true. When people are down about themselves or their life / situation they compensate with something that makes them feel good. In this way people end up eating or drinking too much or even resorting to drugs. All of such answers are bad for the body, though in different ways.

    I guess I was lucky as a kid and a teenager in that life for me was always easy. I always had many friends and always a gf when I wanted one (though not always the one I really wanted, lol!). My confidence was always good and my self image always good, even as I gradually put on weight. Even the extra weight never caused issues because the self confidence was always there. I guess, because of how popular I always was, that is what now makes living so difficult being housebound and almost totally isolated. I have never had to deal with a poor self image and, now that I seem to have that, have no idea on coping.

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • alibabi67alibabi67 Posts: 20Member Whisperer
    edited October 27
    Obesity is a very complex issue. I am very overweight and I have many contributing factors. Firstly I come from heavy stock, we are built like brick poop houses in my family (I think it’s my Latvian side). I was never skinny unlike my sister who has a different dad (my dad’s Latvian so this is where the heavy side comes from). I was then diagnosed with PCOS when I was 18. A condition which contributes to weight gain and makes weight loss very difficult. I also had an abusive childhood physically and mentally and we were very poor so we didn’t have good nutrition and I didn’t grow up eating healthy food or learning about healthy food. I also used food as a comfort especially after I was raped at 14. (In my mind fat people are less likely to get raped) I then suffered an abusive marriage at age 19 where I had a miscarriage due to being beaten. I suffered what I thought was depression on and off my whole life but eventually was diagnosed with bipolar. That medication came with a 6 stone weight gain, plus medication for incontinence that makes me drowsy so I really don’t feel like doing anything. Pain medication that causes drowsiness. Had a total hysterectomy at age 39 so early menopause and couldn’t take HRT for health reasons, there’s a bit more of a struggle.  I have 2 autistic children one who lives away from home and one who is 10 making life incredibly stressful.  Couple this with degenerative osteoarthritis in my knee making me immobile and you have a pretty good recipe for obesity. Yes I know I shouldn’t eat so much bread, yes I know I shouldn’t eat lots of peanuts. I’m not stupid. But to be perfectly honest I don’t have any fight left to fight the flab.
  • JulesA65JulesA65 Posts: 29Member Whisperer
    Up until about 12 years ago, I was 11 stone. Then I was put on Risperidone (side effects inc. Weight gain and permanent hunger) for 6 weeks, and gave up smoking. I ballooned to 15 1/2 stone. After going through the menopause, and battling I gave managed to lose a stone. So I took up cycling, and built a shed and lost inches. I am very active and STILL the drs go on about my weight!! I eat healthily and the bare minimum. Why do people assume you're idle, you eat the wrong foods. The health service needs to get over it's fixation with BMI. BMI doesn't take into account muscle. My weight has caused osteoarthritis in my knees, but by trying to be healthy I got overweight. And all the drs can offer me is slimming world. Which is OK if you can afford the classes, all the foods you need to buy to make the special meals and aren't on a low budget. So don't beat yourself up guys, the health professionals don't really help, or understand. And I bet most of them eat unhealthy, smoke and drink like fishes. So pot calling kettle?
  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    There is a great ponderous of "reasons" that people use to excuse weight gain so let me clarify....

    I spend 90%+ of my time sitting in a recliner chair almost fully reclined and when not then I hobble slowly about putting up with the pain it causes to get drinks and, occasionally food. What I eat is not now and never has been classed as healthy consisting mostly of sweets and biscuits with unhealthy heated meals in between like chilli or curry or something and chips. When I eat bread (not often) it's thick white bread. I drink full fat pepsi, coffee with lots of sugar or sugary squash continuously. I also eat lots of jam tarts and apple or mince pies. I cannot use sweeteners or sugar free stuff because they ALL contain Aspartame which gives me headaches and I get enough pain already. I am what can only be described as "stocky" build with a 46 inch chest and 44 inch hips and have a bone structure that weighs 15% more than usual due to particularity dense and heavy bones. Despite ALL this I am still losing weight because I never eat when my body telly me I'm hungry, only when I am prepared to accept the pain moving causes me. The only thing I would call regular in my diet is a bowl of corn flakes smothered in milk so it softens and then double smothered with tons of sugar. However, I almost never drink alcohol though. I smoke heavily, currently back to my 30 a day but not long ago rose to 60 a day.

    Generally exercise has little effect on weight only how the weight looks and, despite ALL the comments you hear every day, healthy eating is not necessary only preferred. The only necessary part of a diet is if your illness requires it (such as diabetes) and the main reason people have problems with such diets is the peer pressure to eat and drink constantly and the continuous food and drink adverts in the media. My mother was always skinny despite never eating healthy food during her lifetime. The main reason was because she lived during the entire rationing years and healthy food wasn't available for most of it, nor was any great quantity of anything. Healthy eating is purely a modern invention and the stuff removed from it often contains many trace materials which should be replaced in other ways but rarely are. Unlike most she never began overeating when rationing was finally removed in 1954. She also never drank alcohol which is by far the biggest cause of weight gain and addiction in this and most other developed countries.

    Ignoring the "hungry" signals the body gives you is the ONLY way to reduce stomach size (barring surgery) and weight relates almost exactly to stomach size. I used to be able to eat a large pizza, a sugary sweet and cakes to follow easily yet only last night tried to eat a whole medium pizza and ended up vomiting up part of it as my stomach was overfull and believe me when I say that I detest vomiting due to the pain and suffering it causes me and I have only vomited a total of 5 times in the last 10 years (how I know that shows just how much suffering it causes, lol!). I will go back to eating 3/4 of the pizza and reheating the remainder for lunch next day (more likely dinner though).

    I am severely physically disabled (enough to be classed as housebound) and severely mentally disabled (even if most people don't understand it can happen) and only under eat due to lack of help and ability.

    Anyone can lose weight. The hardest part is ignoring other people putting pressure on you and completely ignoring the food and drink programs and adverts which blast out all the time trying to convince people that overeating is a good thing. It isn't and never will be. A person can also save a considerable amount of money by eating less and save a fortune drinking less or not at all. I spend the money saved on tailored cigarettes (being unable to roll any more without spilling most of the tobacco on the floor). I used to spend some of it on women but that isn't an option currently. Everyone needs a vice to feel a little normal.

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • siobhan1siobhan1 Posts: 32Member Whisperer
    I was always under weight when younger, and we never had many treats etc available at home. We relied on free school dinners for a proper meal and sometimes if parents hadn't sorted those we would go without. Dinner at home was 2 packs of 10p noodles and 2 cas of chopped up hot dogs split between 6 kids. I don't remember a time in my life I wasn't hungry and I used to get in trouble when I was about 4 for pinching food. I stayed slim until I had children and a combination of things caused me to out weight on, like low blood pressure and anaemia from not eating in my first pregnancy. The second time round I had a better job and could afford to eat and omg did I eat... too much. I put on 4st while pregnant and have struggled to lose it. I don't eat any more now than I did in my early 20s but I move around less due to my disability. Adapting to moving and eating less when you are used to making the same meals is difficult. My partner I think will get scurvy as I have never seen him eat a vegetable. I also have fussy children. I'm simply too tired to make three separate meals and often just go with what my partner or children are having. Then there's the fact that I've still never got over that constantly hungry feeling from when I was a kid. I have wasting "nice food" and subconsciously don't turn down things when I should. When I feel fed up because I can't go outside or hold knitting needles I eat something nice. I'm not happy with my weight but it's not a case of just losing it to be happy. I think it's a deeply psychological thing and I will have to change my whole life to do it. The way I shop, cook, and how I think about food in general. I sometimes do it and lose about 7lbs and something will happen and I just think **** it I'm eating a biscuit. Then I feel like I've failed and give up. It's like I see food as a treat when I feel like that and that it's because of how things were when I was a child. It's easy for me to point this out to myself but not so easy to fix it.
  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    @siobhan1, your partner won't get scurvy. I haven't eaten vegetables since I was 6 and am now 61 and never had a problem with it. There is far too much paranoia surrounding "healthy eating" and, if they bothered to check, the average persons diet during the rationing years would be described as being too unhealthy to support life.... and yet many did just that.

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
  • siobhan1siobhan1 Posts: 32Member Whisperer
    Topkitten said:
    @siobhan1, your partner won't get scurvy. I haven't eaten vegetables since I was 6 and am now 61 and never had a problem with it. There is far too much paranoia surrounding "healthy eating" and, if they bothered to check, the average persons diet during the rationing years would be described as being too unhealthy to support life.... and yet many did just that.

    TK
    It was more a joke but you make some very good points :) my partner is very underweight. I'm overweight, probably into the obese range if I'm honest with myself, my two children both have allergies. I also have celiac and my partner just doesn't eat veg. Finding meals we can all eat together is exhausting 😁 I sometimes think that I'm not his mother and if he doesn't want to eat what we are having then he will have to make something himself but unfortunately the reason he is under weight is due to MH and he just doesn't eat unless made to. If we don't cook together he doesn't eat. I have to follow a bladder friendly diet which unfortunately means that a lot of veg and fruit are too acidic for me. It's difficult enough being ill without having to shop and cook for 4 people and work out how much I need to buy/freeze to avoid wastage on a low income. Sometimes if everyone is having pizza I just have it even when I'm on a diet and I know I shouldn't! I've started thinking I could just not eat meals at all and try to lose weight that way. My reasons (possibly excuses) get more complicated the more I think about it!
  • thespicemanthespiceman Posts: 2,695Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    Hello every body I am always appreciate every one sharing their stories on these issues.

    Understand one thing here none of you need to suffer if you feel you do that this never your fault.

    As we have seen on the media constant bombardment of underlying messages of what not to eat and what to eat. Very much confusion is reigning around your head, body and mind.  Constantly.

    I am and have been concerned about the weight and the factors surrounding food, diet and nutrition.

    Having been bought up from a family whose attitude add to every day was a controlling factor. Whose food history looking back needs to be addressed.

    Every body needs to recognise that first of all there are no diets that are in my opinion do not work.  This is put about my the food industry of the last 50 years.

    Especially so in the fifties and sixties the word diets did not verbally exist. We those who are interested in the science of food. I am one. Know the health part started in the sixties by certain people in the States.

    Always been in Hollywood of course and the related TV industry.

    Lots of what I know and trust me been doing this a long time. Could understand why gaining weight but eating in my view certain foods were told to contribute to a healthy diet and to my nutrition.

    So started my research after coming off alcohol and addiction.  Lost a hell of a lot of weight.  Anyway need to know why am I getting this wrong.

    Gained qualifications been on courses and the best education is you.

    Learning and by trial and error.  Learning that the body takes time to process information from the brain to the stomach.

    Reason why many feel hungry after a meal still.  Then attack the sweets, chocolate and have another portion.

    Found the well being services . From local councils.  Organisations that help you understand the relation of food and nutrition.  Lots of courses and lots of information.

    Most of the people on the courses who run them are ladies and can help with other issues as well.

    Many of you have seen my meals, things I eat and how simple it is.

    All I can say I am here if any body wishes to ask me anything. Happy to help and offer anything.  Any solutions.

    Lots of misconceptions out there. I understand every body wishes to be a slim svelte community member. What is important is knowing and finding what makes you happy. 

    Food plays such important , special place in many cultures and religions.

    Sometimes we need to take a step back enjoy what we eat and make it special.

    I do every night. Live on my own, turn of the TV and listen to Music instead.

    Is that what is need to do. So be it.

    Lovely to meet those who have contributed and I hope I can help.

    Take care

    @thespiceman





  • TopkittenTopkitten Posts: 886Member Chatterbox
    Most diets do work and almost everyone who sticks to them will lose some weight but the problem runs much deeper than "going on a diet". As I said, weight relates to stomach size and when it reaches a certain level of emptiness it triggers the hungry feeling. It is a normal response that makes almost everyone reach for a snack. The trouble is that it is also the main factor in weight retention as well. A common statement now is "no one should go hungry" but that is exactly what a person needs to do to reduce stomach size and, consequently, weight. Without the body going hungry there is no need for it to kick in stomach reduction because it always has plenty of food in it, topped up as necessary. Stomach shrinkage is a part of the bodies natural conservation process during starving situations. Just think when you saw a starving foreigner who wasn't skinny or a homeless person for that matter. To reduce weight permanently you will need to suffer, eat proper meals but never just "when you are hungry", stick to regular times and ignore the hungry factor.

    However, I will say that dieting when others share your home is much harder because the temptation is much higher plus there will always be someone asking for, and therefore reminding you of, food.

    In much the same way I have become used to pain I have also become used to being hungry and I ignore both, much of the time. This is why I lose weight continuously but not quickly, just a stone or these days half a stone now and again as my body adjusts to a lack of food intake,

    TK
    I am here to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I am all out of bubblegum -- They Live 80 something cult film.
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