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PIP rang to offer me a deal instead of tribunal

unoitsrongunoitsrong Posts: 12Member Whisperer
i first applied for PIP in aug last year, after them not receiving evidence twice, including proof of delivery and them constantly changing their reasons why not to award me points in certain areas which I clearly had evidence for they. I decided to get everything they asked for and more to go up against their reasons why. This was sent special delivery and a descion was made the same day which resulted in the same outcome as before even though I backed up the claims they specifically asked for, upon this decision I rang back and stated how? It’s impossible for those reasons to still stand now you have all the evidence you required. I had a case manager ring me back and state that for some reason all my evidence had been overlooked once again and someone would look over this as she could see there was a lot of detailed evidence supporting my claim. Four weeks later I was awarded a further 2 points which was ridiculous, I decided to appeal to tribunal. I just received a phone call with them offering me a deal to not go to tribunal and in return I will be awarded a 10 points. I declined the offer but it just annoys me how after everything, months and months of them messing me around with all the factors above they now decided they could offer me these extra points on the same evidence they have had for the previous decisions, just goes to show how corrupt this system actually is. I’m really annoyed by this and just hope it finally gets sorted at tribunal where my claim is looked at fairly with no excuses. 

As anyone else been through this situation?


Replies

  • MisscleoMisscleo Posts: 458Member Chatterbox
    Thats really really bad behaviour.
    Hope you get what you should.
    Can you name & shame them.??

  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Posts: 2,446Member Brian Blessed
    Shocking !


    I am a fibrowarrior!
  • feirfeir Posts: 354Member Chatterbox
    edited July 2018
    They know they're going to lose the tribunal. Good.

    Sorry, forgot to say: no i have not been in the same situation but happy for you all the same.
  • Lisa1980Lisa1980 Posts: 10Member Listener
    What was the point offer to u for what is wrong with you can u tell me please I got very bad medical health I waitng a appeal 
  • susan48susan48 Posts: 2,090Member Brian Blessed
    @unoitsrong

    Thats absolutely appalling, stick to your guns and contact you MP, clearly there’s massive issues within the government.

    Let us know how it goes 
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
  • susan48susan48 Posts: 2,090Member Brian Blessed
    @MW9,
    your probably right, they are trying to entice you to accept a lower award than your entitled to.

    I would still contact your MP about this.

    Good luck
  • unoitsrongunoitsrong Posts: 12Member Whisperer
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    What did you do?
  • unoitsrongunoitsrong Posts: 12Member Whisperer
    susan48 said:
    @MW9,
    your probably right, they are trying to entice you to accept a lower award than your entitled to.

    I would still contact your MP about this.

    Good luck
    I don’t mean to sound rude but I’m genuinely asking, what would happen in regards to me going to a local MP
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    What did you do?

    I said I’ll need to think about it and she gave me her direct number to phone back on Monday. I’m going to decline it when I contact her on Monday though, as I believe they’re only phoning me back because they know they’ll probably lose the tribunal. It costs them money to go to a tribunal and by phoning me back and offering me enhanced for mobility suggests to me that they’re trying to meet me half way. Don’t get me wrong, I really don’t want to have to attend a tribunal, but I don’t feel comfortable settling for less than I’m entitled to just because it’s more convenient.

    Ive not seen many posts where people have had a phone call offering them something else to stop it going to a tribunal, so maybe it’s just in cases where the evidence it truly stacked up against them? I might be wrong but that’s my inclination. 
  • susan48susan48 Posts: 2,090Member Brian Blessed
    It would enable you to get help and find out why this has happened and hopefully they can get you answers as to why this has happened in the first place.

    Fighting your corner with you 

    Your not being rude at all.


  • susan48susan48 Posts: 2,090Member Brian Blessed
    edited July 2018
    Have you seen the other thread regarding someone else getting a phone call offering them a different award.


  • unoitsrongunoitsrong Posts: 12Member Whisperer
    MW9 said:
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    What did you do?

    I said I’ll need to think about it and she gave me her direct number to phone back on Monday. I’m going to decline it when I contact her on Monday though, as I believe they’re only phoning me back because they know they’ll probably lose the tribunal. It costs them money to go to a tribunal and by phoning me back and offering me enhanced for mobility suggests to me that they’re trying to meet me half way. Don’t get me wrong, I really don’t want to have to attend a tribunal, but I don’t feel comfortable settling for less than I’m entitled to just because it’s more convenient.

    Ive not seen many posts where people have had a phone call offering them something else to stop it going to a tribunal, so maybe it’s just in cases where the evidence it truly stacked up against them? I might be wrong but that’s my inclination. 
    I’m glad you’re sticking to what you feel is right, I feel the same way, they could have offered us both these points at the start of the claim but they didn’t, they chose to treat us unfairly through no fault of our own. I don’t want to go tribunal but they forced me into this position and now it seems like they are regretting it. I was advised from a couple elderly people who I spoke to at the beginning of my claim and they said they will lie, con and trick you out of everything if they can, fight them til the end. 

    I never actually thought they would and I’d end up doing what they said! 
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    susan48 said:
    Have you seen the other thread regarding someone else getting a phone call offering them a different award.



    That was me who posted it Susan, I hadn’t seen this post before I posted it because I’d only created an account :-)
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    MW9 said:
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    What did you do?

    I said I’ll need to think about it and she gave me her direct number to phone back on Monday. I’m going to decline it when I contact her on Monday though, as I believe they’re only phoning me back because they know they’ll probably lose the tribunal. It costs them money to go to a tribunal and by phoning me back and offering me enhanced for mobility suggests to me that they’re trying to meet me half way. Don’t get me wrong, I really don’t want to have to attend a tribunal, but I don’t feel comfortable settling for less than I’m entitled to just because it’s more convenient.

    Ive not seen many posts where people have had a phone call offering them something else to stop it going to a tribunal, so maybe it’s just in cases where the evidence it truly stacked up against them? I might be wrong but that’s my inclination. 
    I’m glad you’re sticking to what you feel is right, I feel the same way, they could have offered us both these points at the start of the claim but they didn’t, they chose to treat us unfairly through no fault of our own. I don’t want to go tribunal but they forced me into this position and now it seems like they are regretting it. I was advised from a couple elderly people who I spoke to at the beginning of my claim and they said they will lie, con and trick you out of everything if they can, fight them til the end. 

    I never actually thought they would and I’d end up doing what they said! 

    The main advice I can give you, and I’m new to all this as well, is if you firmly believe based on your health condition(s) and circumstances surrounding it, that you’re entitled to something different to what you’ve been awarded, then take it all the way.

    Like I said, I can only assume the people who receive a phone call like ours are the ones who the DWP know are the ones most likely to succeed in a tribunal, and by us hopefully accepting any revised offer negates the need for them to have further involvement.

    For the sake of 1 point on the care component that I’m short on, I’m certainly but relunctantly going forward with a tribunal. Based on my circumstances it shouldn’t really even be close, my situation should put me many points over the 12 points needed on both but unfortunately you and me are just one of many people with disabilities you feel let down by the system. 
  • clarabelleclarabelle Posts: 71Member Whisperer
    I think they might be doing this as a result of the select committee report... 
    if you haven't already ask them to put their 'offer' in writing... what they are suggesting is a decision under MR and you can't approach the tribunal until you have the MR in writing.
    youll win at tribunal I imagine, but it's a long wait time and not an entirely pleasant experience.
    good for you to sticking to your guns... this isn't something they can haggle on.. the regs and criteria are really clear. 
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,454Member Brian Blessed
    I think they might be doing this as a result of the select committee report... 
    if you haven't already ask them to put their 'offer' in writing... what they are suggesting is a decision under MR and you can't approach the tribunal until you have the MR in writing.
    They won't put it in writing. As you say it then becomes a new decision with additional appeal rights.

    What they want is an unconfirmed agreement that you won't take your appeal any further in exchange for an increase. If you refuse, the offer is withdrawn and there is no record for the Tribunal that it was offered.
  • clarabelleclarabelle Posts: 71Member Whisperer
    That's outrageous.  If it were mevid phone them to discuss the 'offer' and record the call. 
    If they are making an offer of increased points surely legally they must put that in writing.
    If they dont/won't then it might be best to send a letter outlining the call they made and giving reasons why you reject it, stating you view the call as a MR. You can then present that letter and a copy of your phone records as evidence to the tribunal. 
  • unoitsrongunoitsrong Posts: 12Member Whisperer
    That's outrageous.  If it were mevid phone them to discuss the 'offer' and record the call. 
    If they are making an offer of increased points surely legally they must put that in writing.
    If they dont/won't then it might be best to send a letter outlining the call they made and giving reasons why you reject it, stating you view the call as a MR. You can then present that letter and a copy of your phone records as evidence to the tribunal. 
    How would I approach this and thank you for the advice, it’s very much appreciated 
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    edited July 2018
    That's outrageous.  If it were mevid phone them to discuss the 'offer' and record the call. 
    If they are making an offer of increased points surely legally they must put that in writing.
    If they dont/won't then it might be best to send a letter outlining the call they made and giving reasons why you reject it, stating you view the call as a MR. You can then present that letter and a copy of your phone records as evidence to the tribunal. 
    How would I approach this and thank you for the advice, it’s very much appreciated 
    I’m going to be recording the call when I phone back on Monday. If you download the app ‘Tape A Call’, it’s on the App Store for iPhone, I’m sure it’ll be available for Android too if you have one. I try to record every important call I make using this app just as a back up, you never know when having a recording could prove useful. 

    You have the Lite version of the app, which is still good, but I ended up paying the £10.99 for the Pro version, it’s been well worth it. 
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,454Member Brian Blessed
    Personally I refuse to discuss anything over the telephone especially when it relates to finance or benefits.
    If it is that important enough for them to ring me it should be important enough to put it in writing and send it to me.
  • Jason01Jason01 Posts: 20Member Whisperer
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    How long did it take to get it enhanced  from first decision please . I got six weekso before I lose my car, which will cause me a massive issues
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 5,753Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    Jason01 said:
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    How long did it take to get it enhanced  from first decision please . I got six weekso before I lose my car, which will cause me a massive issues
    It's fairly rare to get offered a higher award from DWP before the Tribunal hearing, so please don't expect that. If you're at Tribunal stage then expect a long wait because back logs are huge across the country. Some are waiting 1 year for their hearing date. Good luck.
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,454Member Brian Blessed
    edited July 2018
    I am lost for words sometimes when I hear of this delay and it is stated to be causing severe mental illnesses. If someone is that ill mentally (and yes I have been there) and they can cope with the stress and anxiety caused by that delay and then appearing at a Tribunal then I would actually doubt the sincerity of their statements and claim. When I was that ill, spending years in and out of institutions I was kept well away from that sort of stress as it would have put me back at the beginning again. It was all dealt with by my CPN, Social Worker, Local Authority WRO and Consultant. I do appreciate that this was during the years of 1995 through to 2002 and maybe things have now changed. But even now I could not cope with it hence why I gave it up.

  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,149Member Brian Blessed
    MW9 said:
    That's outrageous.  If it were mevid phone them to discuss the 'offer' and record the call. 
    If they are making an offer of increased points surely legally they must put that in writing.
    If they dont/won't then it might be best to send a letter outlining the call they made and giving reasons why you reject it, stating you view the call as a MR. You can then present that letter and a copy of your phone records as evidence to the tribunal. 
    How would I approach this and thank you for the advice, it’s very much appreciated 
    I’m going to be recording the call when I phone back on Monday. If you download the app ‘Tape A Call’, it’s on the App Store for iPhone, I’m sure it’ll be available for Android too if you have one. I try to record every important call I make using this app just as a back up, you never know when having a recording could prove useful. 

    You have the Lite version of the app, which is still good, but I ended up paying the £10.99 for the Pro version, it’s been well worth it. 
    This has been dealt with on the other thread. It would be very foolish indeed to record the call. 
  • ToffeeToffee Posts: 153Member Chatterbox
    The system a disgrace 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,149Member Brian Blessed
    And yet what people are describing here is the system beginning to work as it ought.
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,454Member Brian Blessed
    edited July 2018
    And yet what people are describing here is the system beginning to work as it ought.
    What? the DWP starting to operate a bartering system? What the DWP ought to be doing is if following a review of the claim when it becomes apparent that a higher award should be made, they should simply make a new decision. If the claimant still doesn't agree with it then new appeal rights come into play.

    To start  to barter  'we will give you this only if you agree to do that' is beyond what the DWP should be about.

    I don't agree - - follow the rules and make a new decision.

    Incidentally how would you square this if the claimant has refused to give their telephone number? Or they are not there when they ring the claimant?
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    Jason01 said:
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    How long did it take to get it enhanced  from first decision please . I got six weekso before I lose my car, which will cause me a massive issues
    Hi @Jason01,

    My PIP review was about December/January, in which I sent the form and supporting evidence. In April I was then informed I was being kept on the same points for both components, in light of everything I’d detailed and my numerous health conditions deteriorating and level of care increasing. In hindsight I should have been awarded enhanced for both when I originally applied for PIP 5 years ago but it was a process I was new to and was naive having never claimed any form of benefit previously.

    I sent the mandatory reconsideration letter within 1 week of that letter being received and had to wait about 5/6 weeks to hear a response which takes us up to about the end of May. That letter informed me they were increasing the daily living points by 3 and keeping the mobility the same.

    Within about 2/3 weeks of this I had sent all the relevant documentation to initiate the tribunal which was around the middle of June and received a response saying they’ve received all my information.

    The phone call offering me enhanced on the mobility component came yesterday (Friday) so you’re looking at the whole process being about 7 months so far.

    Like another member has mentioned, I don’t think these phone calls are compulsory and are possibly only to people who they know will have a strong chance at the tribunal. So I wouldn’t hold out for the call - but if you feel that your decision is wrong and you have all the appropriate medical evidence and evidence of how your health condition(s) effect you, then unfortunately a tribunal is the only other route available. 

  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,149Member Brian Blessed
    I didn’t say working. I said beginning to work. Clearly this nonsense is wrong but it’s also way way better than “I’m sorry but you’ve appealed so it’s up to the tribunal now”. 

    I actually actively discourage claimants or potential claimants from giving their number. Certainly solves this problem. Had one try to ring me as the rep but I declined to engage and told them what we were aiming for. They declined to make that offer and lost at appeal.
  • MW9MW9 Posts: 19Member Talkative
    edited July 2018
    And yet what people are describing here is the system beginning to work as it ought.
    The system I’ve experienced is one where vast amounts of medical evidence and in-depth, detailed explanations on how it severely impacts day-to-day life are either majorly overlooked and/or misconstrued.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Posts: 3,149Member Brian Blessed
    I’m not disagreeing but making offers is the start of a change of mindset. Ditto the sudden appearance of extra points on MRs.
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,454Member Brian Blessed
    edited July 2018
    I can fully understand extra points being given at MR stage which is presumably on account of additional evidence being received. I would hate to think that these extra points are given because the claimant had the audacity to challenge the first decision. 
    I can only say it as it is the DWP should do the right thing first time and not, as it sometimes appears, hold out to see if the claimant objects.

    In my particular case and after additional evidence had been received it still took two more attempts to get Enhanced for both from them. It was as though they were intent on holding back not willing to give everything at once - it went from 0 to standard for both then to enhanced for both all based on the same evidence.

    It won't affect me thank goodness, but if it did and I had a phone call of that nature they would politely be told to put it in writing for me to consider. No doubt that would stop them in their tracks with this ridiculous bartering system.
  • Jason01Jason01 Posts: 20Member Whisperer
    MW9 said:
    Jason01 said:thing is , they're saying that if I have the ability to drive I don't need extra help , this makes no sense as I have  mobility adjusted car 
    MW9 said:
    I’ve had the same phone call today although it was to increased my mobility from standard to enhanced with my care staying at standard. I firmly believe based on my various health conditions and all the evidence I’ve sent I should be on enhanced for both. I’m inclined to believe the phone call may be then meeting half way because they know they’ll lose at the tribunal?
    How long did it take to get it enhanced  from first decision please . I got six weekso before I lose my car, which will cause me a massive issues
    Hi @Jason01,

    My PIP review was about December/January, in which I sent the form and supporting evidence. In April I was then informed I was being kept on the same points for both components, in light of everything I’d detailed and my numerous health conditions deteriorating and level of care increasing. In hindsight I should have been awarded enhanced for both when I originally applied for PIP 5 years ago but it was a process I was new to and was naive having never claimed any form of benefit previously.

    I sent the mandatory reconsideration letter within 1 week of that letter being received and had to wait about 5/6 weeks to hear a response which takes us up to about the end of May. That letter informed me they were increasing the daily living points by 3 and keeping the mobility the same.

    Within about 2/3 weeks of this I had sent all the relevant documentation to initiate the tribunal which was around the middle of June and received a response saying they’ve received all my information.

    The phone call offering me enhanced on the mobility component came yesterday (Friday) so you’re looking at the whole process being about 7 months so far.

    Like another member has mentioned, I don’t think these phone calls are compulsory and are possibly only to people who they know will have a strong chance at the tribunal. So I wouldn’t hold out for the call - but if you feel that your decision is wrong and you have all the appropriate medical evidence and evidence of how your health condition(s) effect you, then unfortunately a tribunal is the only other route available. 


  • dave111dave111 Posts: 2Member Listener
    Just had a phone call myself offering a low payment which I turned down... must admit I’m feeling a bit nervous about going to a tribunal.. do you think that being made a low offer is them knowing I will get a higher one at the tribunal ? 
  • missmmissm Posts: 39Member Whisperer
    was you offered 0 points to begin with ? with them offering you a low offer ?

  • dave111dave111 Posts: 2Member Listener
    No I was awarded 6 points for Daily living and 4 points for mobility, they offered me 57 pound a week just for daily living I didn’t even know you can get an award just for that part 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 5,753Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    dave111 said:
    No I was awarded 6 points for Daily living and 4 points for mobility, they offered me 57 pound a week just for daily living I didn’t even know you can get an award just for that part 
    You can be awarded either or both.
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,454Member Brian Blessed
    dave111 said:
    Just had a phone call myself offering a low payment which I turned down... must admit I’m feeling a bit nervous about going to a tribunal.. do you think that being made a low offer is them knowing I will get a higher one at the tribunal ? 
    Personally I would have taken them up with the offer to get some money rolling in.
    Then waited a week or so after the new decision letter arrives and put in another appeal.
    The DWP won't be happy but who cares

    Do it that way it is a win win for you.
  • missmmissm Posts: 39Member Whisperer
    how long have you been waiting to go tribunal before they telephoned you ? 

  • Wreck01Wreck01 Posts: 1Member Listener
    I submitted a claim in March 2017,which I received 0 points across the board. So I appealed the decision and was able to provide proof on each point to refute the assessors 'proof' of my ability for work. From submitting the appeal, I've had 17 phone calls by PIPS and a letter to accept an offer of standard living and mobility before the tribunal. Points they 'magically' found upon review of original application!!!!!
    This is still ongoing and I have yet to receive an appeal date. As it stands today, I am still waiting for the appeal date. 20 months of having to prove my MS is preventing me from doing normal things!!! I'm having to see a counseller, physiotherapist, have adaptions done to my house and of course the stress of this situation has impacted my disability and what was relatively inactive RRMS has progressed to highly active. I have to be honest, this progression is due to the stress levels of having to fight to prove I am disabled and the PIPS disregard of medical proof.

    How can they justify putting someone through such an ordeal and actually causing a progression in their disabilities???? 
  • Pippa_ScopePippa_Scope Posts: 5,239Administrator Scope community team
    Welcome to the community @Wreck01, and thanks for sharing this with us.

    I'm so sorry to hear about your experiences and that you're having to deal with this on top of everything else. I really hope you get your appeal date and things move forward for you soon, please do keep us updated.
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Posts: 4,206Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    You should ring the tribunal for an update on waiting times in your area
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • carmancarman Posts: 1Member Listener
    I've been appealing for my older son since March last year  as my son has a mental disability which he was born with I have been his carer since he was a baby and to be honest a disability you can't see has been one of the most hardest things I've ever had to cope with because other people do not see it and this was the reason he was refused at the first assessment even though they had  evidence, In other words, he looked normal so he is normal anyway my point is I have suffered mental stress  having to deal with PIPS the DWP and their constant refusal It took me a long hard  week to try to encourage, my son, to even go to the first PIP assessment as he is socially withdrawn and never leaves the house and  then when they told me he would have to go to a Tribunal and sit in front of 4 persons and explain his self to them I thought to myself this is never going to happen so after writing all these letters of appeal  and all the stress and hardship  it has caused me and  my son I came to the conclusion it was all over as I told them he will not be going to the Tribunal Then months later I had a letter and a phone call asking if I would except the basic rate for Living Allowance and basic rate for Mobility  even though my son was on Middle rate for both I was  still  happy because I cant  put myself or my son through this ordeal  again at least he will be getting something and I'm greatful for that and I should imagine they will have to  back date all those payments Carers aswell.            
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