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Pip

darcieolliedarcieollie Posts: 29Member Connected
Hi I was awarded standard for daily and enhanced mobility 12 months ago for multiple sclerosis after a 3 year fight with Dwp. My MS worsened by sensory numbness and decided to tell Dwp about this back in December 2018 they sent me for a assessment some 3 months ago and I phoned them to see if a decision has been made and they tell me standard for both. I’ve never felt so down hearing this today. Can they actually tell you this over the phone

Replies

  • Ami2301Ami2301 Posts: 6,129Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @darcieollie I'm sorry to hear how you are feeling, I would advise to wait for the decision letter. Please keep us updated :)
    Disability Gamechanger - 2019
  • ClintsterClintster Posts: 1Member Listener
    How can someone who has ms only be awarded standard rate what is wrong with these people who assess these cases
  • darcieolliedarcieollie Posts: 29Member Connected
    I wish I hadn’t told them my circumstances had got worse because now they say I’m going to be on standard rate because capita says I’m better
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 17,389Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    Hi,

    If a decision's made then when you ask them, yes they will tell you on the phone. If you haven't requested a copy of the assessment report then i'd advise you to ring DWP to request it.

    You now have 1 month from the date of that decision to request the Mandatory Reconsideration (MR). You should put this in writing stating where you think you should have scored those points and your reasons why. Adding 2-3 examples of what happened the last time you attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to you.

    Avoid mentioning any lies that may have been told in the report because they won't be interested in any of those.

    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • wilkowilko Posts: 2,000Member Disability Gamechanger
    Hello, I am a MS sufferer, and on getting standard on my first pip award knew and felt this was the right award 12 months later I informed DWP that my mobility had worsened and filled in another form had a F2F and was awarded standard care and enhanced mobility. I think you will have to request an MR  and most likely go onto the Tribunal stage. I never had an ESA assessment as I had my pip a few weeks earlier and the information and evidence was enough to do a paper assessment and I was placed in the support group. As I will be required to reapply for pip, reassessed I have started collecting medical evidence ready for the event requesting copies of any hospital, doctors or physio reports where or when I think or know they will be helpful. For those who don’t about MS it effect people in many different ways and can impact on people’s lives in a varied and frustrating ways.
  • darcieolliedarcieollie Posts: 29Member Connected
    1 year ago after a 3 year fight with Dwp they finally awarded me standard daily & enhanced mobility then I said in December that my symptoms have worsened, so they send me to capita for a face to face and they tell me standard for both I’m really annoyed at them. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 17,389Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    It's always risky when reporting a worsening of condition. You should always get face to face advice before doing this.

    A worsening of condition doesn't mean you would score more points for a higher award. You should always look to see where you could score more points for that higher award, did you do this before reporting changes?
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • darcieolliedarcieollie Posts: 29Member Connected
    Yes she didn’t even say anything about my mobility 
  • darcieolliedarcieollie Posts: 29Member Connected
    Wish I hadn’t been so honest now
  • darcieolliedarcieollie Posts: 29Member Connected
    Nothing else changed apart from having numbness in my face hands arm leg
  • ilovecatsilovecats Posts: 1,026Member Pioneering
    Clintster said:
    How can someone who has ms only be awarded standard rate what is wrong with these people who assess these cases
    Probably because the diagnosis is irrelevant, it’s how the condition affects them. Some people with MS can lead largely normal lives with minimal restriction and some people are completely bedbound and very poorly, and then others vary in between. Does everyone who suffers the same condition deserve the same standard of award? Because that is what DLA was and that’s why it changed. 
  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    edited June 2019
    ilovecats said:
    Clintster said:
    How can someone who has ms only be awarded standard rate what is wrong with these people who assess these cases
    Probably because the diagnosis is irrelevant, it’s how the condition affects them. Some people with MS can lead largely normal lives with minimal restriction and some people are completely bedbound and very poorly, and then others vary in between. Does everyone who suffers the same condition deserve the same standard of award? Because that is what DLA was and that’s why it changed. 
    But then isn't that all to do with how well the PIP2 form was completed and how well you held it together during the face to face assessment?
    Take me, on the face of it you would never know that there are any medical or mental health issues. I can argue with the best of them as well as manipulate discussions if someone is trying to hone onto something that is painful for me to discuss or even think about.
    I have never had any help either completing the forms or having to attend a Tribunal.

    Yet the conditions I have would lead most people including doctors and consultants to be very worried about my long term health prognosis as well suspect that life must be pretty difficult.

    Your problem is that the assessors are extremely poorly trained in developing a discussion with a claimant so as to gently tease out what the claimant is not wanting or simply not saying. They don't appear to go in for any psychological understanding of how to get people to open up. Assessors can use a keyboard, make wild assumptions that are not based on the 50% principle over a year and start from a point of believing that almost every claimant is in some part attempting to make a fraudulent claim.

    As for the relevance of a diagnosis, why do the DWP and assessors accept the 'assumed' difficulties when someone is fast tracked following the submission of a DS1500? I know quite a few who are in that category including one that has less than 6 months to live due to Motor Neurone. That particular individual is still able to function almost as normal yet he had a DS1500.
  • ilovecatsilovecats Posts: 1,026Member Pioneering
    So your suggesting that if a Doctor completes a DS1500 then the DWP should ignore it?

    You've just said that you yourself do not look disabled. Assuming someone with a DS1500 is could not be disabled because they don’t look it is hypocritical.
  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    ilovecats said:
    So your suggesting that if a Doctor completes a DS1500 then the DWP should ignore it?

    You've just said that you yourself do not look disabled. Assuming someone with a DS1500 is could not be disabled because they don’t look it is hypocritical.
    Ignore it? Not at all. It doesn't always follow that when a DS1500 is issued the claimant will be entitled to enough descriptors and points. Surely the DS1500 should be for fast tracking a claim but that it should also follow the normal assessment process that everyone has to go through.
    You said that PIP has nothing to do with a diagnosis, so why treat it as thought it does?
    What I was attempting to say that looks can be deceptive where a claimant is concerned. 
    If a guy turned up at an assessment that you were running, and a DS1500 was on file yet he looked the picture of health and had not disclosed in full detail his difficulties on the PIP2 how would you assess him? Based on what he looked like? How eh presented himself? Or just assume that because a DS1500 was issued he MUST be so seriously disabled and the impact great?

    I remember a guy back in the early 90's that had been given 6 months to live and had been awarded DLA based on that from. Yet over 12 months later he was still working a full day shift driving 8 wheeler and artic tipper lorries in and around London.
  • ilovecatsilovecats Posts: 1,026Member Pioneering
    twonker said:
    ilovecats said:
    So your suggesting that if a Doctor completes a DS1500 then the DWP should ignore it?

    You've just said that you yourself do not look disabled. Assuming someone with a DS1500 is could not be disabled because they don’t look it is hypocritical.
    Ignore it? Not at all. It doesn't always follow that when a DS1500 is issued the claimant will be entitled to enough descriptors and points. Surely the DS1500 should be for fast tracking a claim but that it should also follow the normal assessment process that everyone has to go through.
    You said that PIP has nothing to do with a diagnosis, so why treat it as thought it does?
    What I was attempting to say that looks can be deceptive where a claimant is concerned. 
    If a guy turned up at an assessment that you were running, and a DS1500 was on file yet he looked the picture of health and had not disclosed in full detail his difficulties on the PIP2 how would you assess him? Based on what he looked like? How eh presented himself? Or just assume that because a DS1500 was issued he MUST be so seriously disabled and the impact great?

    I remember a guy back in the early 90's that had been given 6 months to live and had been awarded DLA based on that from. Yet over 12 months later he was still working a full day shift driving 8 wheeler and artic tipper lorries in and around London.
    You always conveniently ‘remember a guy’ or ‘have a neighbour’ or ‘know a person’. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 17,389Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    It's quite sad to think that someone thinks that even though a person has been diagnosed as having 6 months or less to live they should still go through the normal assessment process. Oh dear me.... :(
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    ilovecats said:
    twonker said:
    ilovecats said:
    So your suggesting that if a Doctor completes a DS1500 then the DWP should ignore it?

    You've just said that you yourself do not look disabled. Assuming someone with a DS1500 is could not be disabled because they don’t look it is hypocritical.
    Ignore it? Not at all. It doesn't always follow that when a DS1500 is issued the claimant will be entitled to enough descriptors and points. Surely the DS1500 should be for fast tracking a claim but that it should also follow the normal assessment process that everyone has to go through.
    You said that PIP has nothing to do with a diagnosis, so why treat it as thought it does?
    What I was attempting to say that looks can be deceptive where a claimant is concerned. 
    If a guy turned up at an assessment that you were running, and a DS1500 was on file yet he looked the picture of health and had not disclosed in full detail his difficulties on the PIP2 how would you assess him? Based on what he looked like? How eh presented himself? Or just assume that because a DS1500 was issued he MUST be so seriously disabled and the impact great?

    I remember a guy back in the early 90's that had been given 6 months to live and had been awarded DLA based on that from. Yet over 12 months later he was still working a full day shift driving 8 wheeler and artic tipper lorries in and around London.
    You always conveniently ‘remember a guy’ or ‘have a neighbour’ or ‘know a person’. 
    I know a lot of people in lots of places where I have lived from all walks of life. You could say that people interest me.
  • cristobalcristobal Posts: 895Member Pioneering
    edited June 2019
    @twonker - the problem is that all of your little anecdotes are negative - and repeat what you have already posted under your previous username (@yadnad)

    I realise how difficult it is for you and - I am sorry for that - but do you not have any positive stories?
  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    edited June 2019
    It's quite sad to think that someone thinks that even though a person has been diagnosed as having 6 months or less to live they should still go through the normal assessment process. Oh dear me.... :(
    The point I was making was that Ilovecats said that a diagnosis is not considered for PIP. Then I find that simply having a DS1500 would automatically give an award based on that diagnosis. Surely then that with a diagnosis of say Parkinsons etc it is fairly obvious that there could well be some serious disabilities giving rise to impacts. Parkinsons, much like Chronic Pancreatitis will not by itself give any award despite that both are life limiting and the impact caused will never improve - just confused as the award norm for both is between 3 and 5 years. 
     
    However I do note that PIP is different than DLA in this regard. If death hasn't happened within that sort of period the DWP will want to look at the award again. With DLA a DS1500 was effectively a means to get a 'lifetime' award no matter when they died.
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Posts: 5,256Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    twonker said:I know a lot of people in lots of places where I have lived from all walks of life. You could say that people interest me.
    And yet you seem to be so lonely
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    twonker said:I know a lot of people in lots of places where I have lived from all walks of life. You could say that people interest me.
    And yet you seem to be so lonely
    lonely??? What gives you that impression?
    Far from it, I lock myself away from the world in my quiet office at weekends and most nights. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 17,389Community champion Disability Gamechanger
    edited June 2019
    @Yadnad @twonker the point is, is that your comment is quite sad, which ever way you try to twist it.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    edited June 2019
    cristobal said:
    @twonker - the problem is that all of your little anecdotes are negative - and repeat what you have already posted under your previous username (@yadnad)

    I realise how difficult it is for you and - I am sorry for that - but do you not have any positive stories?
    Of course mainly centred around my family which are not relevant on here.
    As for good stories about the government and it's many departments - none that I can think of. 
    I've had Pension credit claims closed down by the DWP for not sending information to them within 30 days which was impossible as it was held by a 3rd party who refused me access to it.
    I've had a DLA award closed down because I was in hospital for many months and as such was unable fill out the renewal claim within the timeframe allowed.
    I've had another disability benefit closed down by the DWP for the above same reason and it took 7 years to argue that it should not have been closed which the DWP agreed was the case but they refused to pay the missing 7 years of money as I didn't actually appeal at the time I just complained.
    I've been prosecuted by the police/CPS for working and claiming unemployment benefit. Spent 1 month in prison, the rest suspended. On release argued at a Tribunal that I had done nothing wrong and did not owe the DWP any money The Tribunal agreed and when asked why I pleaded guilty at Crown Court I told them that the barrister/solicitor advised me to.
    The list goes on and on. 

    At the age of 69 I now find that what M's Rudd said about no further assessments is a load of rubbish. There are going to be approx. 270,000 existing PIP claimants over state pension age having to go through a final PIP face to face assessment so as to qualify for the 10 year soft touch award that she promised. You can bet your bottom dollar that both the assessors and the DWP will be taking a harder line in looking at every possible opportunity to remove as many of them off PIP so as to save money. 
  • ilovecatsilovecats Posts: 1,026Member Pioneering
    And I can bet your bottom dollar that assessors have no targets to work to at all and the majority aim to award on the merit of what they see in front of them.
  • cristobalcristobal Posts: 895Member Pioneering
    twonker said

    I've had a DLA award closed down because I was in hospital for many months and as such was unable fill out the renewal claim within the timeframe allowed.
    I've had another disability benefit closed down by the DWP for the above same reason and it took 7 years to argue that it should not have been closed which the DWP agreed was the case but they refused to pay the missing 7 years of money as I didn't actually appeal at the time I just complained.
    I've been prosecuted by the police/CPS for working and claiming unemployment benefit. Spent 1 month in prison, the rest suspended. On release argued at a Tribunal that I had done nothing wrong and did not owe the DWP any money The Tribunal agreed and when asked why I pleaded guilty at Crown Court I told them that the barrister/solicitor advised me to.
    The list goes on and on. 

    @twonker - I've said before that I am sorry for what's happened to you, and I truly am.

    I'm not medically trained but I don't think continually posting about it on here (and creating another username to continue to do so) is a good way to deal with it. The constant repetition of the negative stories isn't helping anyone and, most importantly, it's not helping you. Could you seek help to find a better way of dealing with your problems? 

  • twonkertwonker Posts: 617Member - under moderation Pioneering
    ilovecats said:
    And I can bet your bottom dollar that assessors have no targets to work to at all and the majority aim to award on the merit of what they see in front of them.
    I never said anything about targets - where did that come from?
    On merit? Why the lies in the reports then?
    You do the talk but did you actually do the walk when assessing? 
    Of course they intend to re-assess every one of the 270,000 pensioners. The DWP are not going to just convert all 270,000 awards to a 10 year one with only a light touch at the 10 year point without one final opportunity of upping the anti to try to clear as many awards as they can.
    It is crazy to think that they would actually offer this length of award to everyone irrespective of their conditions or points already awarded. As I say it will be a witch hunt to clear the decks certainly of the mobility element. 
    My next assessment next year is going to be fun and games as to finding out who controls the assessment, the claimant or the assessor.   
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