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Who has trouble sleeping?

Tammyjane33Tammyjane33 Member, Community champion Posts: 460 Pioneering
Even though I take meds and sleeping pills they don't seem to help 

Replies

  • OverlyAnxiousOverlyAnxious Member Posts: 335 Pioneering
    Yep, I do.  It's ridiculous as I live with chronic fatigue and can barely keep my eyes open or walk from one room to another in the evening but get in to bed and just can't switch off, my mind starts racing, intrusive thoughts keep popping up from weeks, month and years previously, and it's hard to stop with no distractions other than the radio.

    I also find my digestive system switches into over-drive at night so I struggle with nausea and reflux, and near constant gurgling and shifting both top and bottom ends most nights. Plus uncontrollable shaking and sweating and light headedness etc around once or twice a week on average.  I don't know how much of that is normal, and how much is being caused or magnified by my health anxiety.  Then on those nights, about an hour or so in bed I'll feel so desperate that I'll need to get up and go to the loo despite making sure I've been twice before bed, and not drinking anything after 8pm...  I always feel really nauseous when I get up for a wee so try to avoid it as much as possible, not sure what more I can do though!  I should also add I don't drink any alcohol, caffeine, fizzy or sugary drinks at all, only ever water.

    It's got to the point now where I'm scared to go to bed and frequently have panic symptoms start around 11pm, but have no choice but to try and go to bed due partly to the fatigue and partly because I can't cope with change at all...I've tried staying in a recliner chair instead or even going to bed later but both of those caused even more anxiety!

    Last night was a bad one unfortunately so it's all still fresh in my mind...  I don't use phone or laptop in the evening (I get fuzzy vision with the fatigue so can't focus on any text anyway), just try and watch some 'easy' TV for the last hour or two before bed to relax, comedy ideally but travel docs or similar too, just something without any potential anxiety triggers.

    Sorry that's turned into a bit of a novel but I really would like to know how other people deal with insomnia!  I don't want to risk any sleeping medication either as I'm worried about them being too effective and soiling the bed instead.  
  • SeanchaiSeanchai Member Posts: 272 Pioneering
    I have various health problem but my tinnitus is the one that stops me getting a sleep . When my very loud ( sounds like a jet engine just before take off) tinnitus first started i never slept for three days and nights ...i was in a bad way , i never realised just how bad i was but my wife went to the doctor with me ....he advised sleeping tablets and anxiety /depression tablets .... i take these at night , w few hours later and i am out to the world ....just for a few hours but at least i can deal with tiredness now . Sometimes i do not get to sleep until the early hours ...but i eventually sleep takes over me . Of course the first thing i hear when i awake is that damn jet engine ....( another way to describe that constant noise is like standing under a massive fountain in the jungle ) ..i have tried everything possible for tinnintus ...but i,m afraid nothing works . The tinnitus is only in my right ear but it also robbed me of hearing in that ear , i have menieres as well and use bluetooth ( crossover) hearing aids and that allows me to hear a bit in my left ear . I would advise you to see your doc about sleeping ( or your lack of it) its hard to face the day ahead without having a bit of sleep , so please go to your doctor and have a word with him .
  • exdvrexdvr Member Posts: 303 Pioneering
    I find that if I have my last drink maybe about an hour before going to bed I can generally drop off to sleep fairly quickly, but I have to wrap myself up like into a cocoon.  Must keep hands and feet warm plus pull a sheet up over the back of my head.  Anything to keep myself well insulated when the nights are cooler.  Listening to classical music on an ultra-low volume on my Kindle under my pillow also helps.  Trying to clear problems out of my head helps to relax too although that's sometimes easier said than done.

    Best wishes.

    DLTBGYD

  • M_AnthonyM_Anthony Member, Community champion Posts: 210 Pioneering
    Has anyone tried Cognitive behavioural therapy? It may be worth talking to your doctor about.


  • Ami2301Ami2301 Community champion Posts: 6,302 Disability Gamechanger
    I take a sleeping tablet which does help me go to sleep, but not with actual sleeping. If I'm really struggling to get to sleep, then I ask for the window to be slightly open or the fan to be on the lower setting to make my body cool, but not cold cold, just cool enough until I need to be covered in my duvet or blanket. Being cosy and warm then sends me to sleep.
    Community Champion
    Disability Gamechanger - 2019
  • pollyanna1052pollyanna1052 Member Posts: 1,860 Disability Gamechanger
    I take amitriptyline at 9pm...it can make me drowsy.

    Sometimes I fall asleep before tablet time then it takes ages to get back to sleep.


  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Administrator Posts: 7,698 Scope community team
    Sleeping is something I've always found difficult because of pain or simply not being able to stay asleep. It's very frustrating when you know you really need to rest.
    Community Partner
    Scope
  • thespicemanthespiceman Community champion Posts: 6,224 Disability Gamechanger
    Hello @Tammyjane33   Sorry you having problem sleeping.

    Please if I can suggest a few things. Mainly diet and nutritional.

    Also make sleep a priority schedule it and plan it.

    Insomnia is a difficult condition to manage and it does need addressing is this a problem.

    My own circumstances right now have new meds so effecting sleep but know how to address this.

    I would also suggest talking of diet and wellbeing.

    Do the following may be useful.

    Eat a healthy balanced diet plenty of Pulses, Whole grains and Vegetables. Not too close to bedtime.

    Lean Meat, Chicken, Turkey.

    Pasta or Potatoes if you ever had a Pasta salad lunch or a Potato one makes you sleepy.  So use them at night time.

    Anything spicy or heavy the systems body can not adjust also eat nothing a snack or nothing before bedtimes.

    Disturbed  sleep. can happen. So can I know this myself computer, Tv and the bright screen the brain  is till functioning needs to wind down switch off.

    Most meds and certain conditions can be effected sleep. Those anti depressants, certain ones  like Sertraline and those certain drugs at night anti depressants like Mirtazapine used take on a night time two hours before bedtime.

    Sometimes foods contained tryptophan an enzyme on milk whole grain bread and other aspects of foods are used to aid restful sleep.

    What happens when we sleep is the stages of going to sleep that you need to recognise and be aware of.

    If you set a schedule your ideal time will know. 

    If you go to bed around 10pm takes around forty minutes to an hour before the brain goes in REM stage then deep sleep.

    Could be 11pm to midnight before the body decides to sleep .

    Rapid Eye Movement this happens we close our eyes and this the rapid movements of the eyes after around thirty to forty minutes.

    Deep sleep can be effected by a number of factors, the room you have, is it too dark or too light. Too warm too hot too cold.

    In my own circumstances being an alcoholic my hours were night times days and days night times.

    Called Numbertal lifestyle. 

    Had to go to a clinic to re adjust the sleep patterns. Also the mental health charities do a lot on sleep. Because many meds, anxiety, mental health conditions effect sleep.

    Including pain and restless legs.

    Please if I can further use music chill out. Turn off all electrical. Meditate in a quiet room .

    Have warm not hot milky drinks laced with honey, eat something sensible and nutritional.

    Late night pizzas do not work or remove caffeine in cola, chocolate, coffee and tea.

    Caffeine is a stimulant effects sleep patterns.

    As is alcohol, never works.

    Hope that helps.

    Please if you are concerned speak to your GP.  Happy to be supportive .

    Please take care.

    @thespiceman









    Community Champion
    SCOPE Volunteer Award Engaging Communities 2019
    Mental Health advice, guidance and information to all members
    Nutrition, Diet, Wellbeing, Addiction.
    Recipes
  • April2018momApril2018mom Member - under moderation Posts: 2,826 Disability Gamechanger
    Reading helps. So does vigorous hard exercise. I avoid naps and instead keep my mind occupied. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Community champion Posts: 18,522 Disability Gamechanger
    Yes, i can relate to the not being able to sleep. I have no problems falling asleep but for me, i can't stay asleep, which is very frustrating. I wake up several times a night and often lay in bed awake with my cat for company next to me. Then usually he'll wake me up about 5am scratching something, i swear he's telling me it's time to get up now lol. He's so cheeky.

    I tried sleeping tablets but they didn't work for me so stopped taking them a long time ago.

    Vigorous hard exercise is not something i would even think of doing. Having experienced severe pain for several years through out the whole of my body, one thing i stay well away from is this.

    I find myself napping several times a day, with the evenings being the worst time. To try to stay away is the most difficult thing and i usually miss the end of a program i'm trying to watch on the TV, so annoying. Now i record most things, so at least i can start again lol.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • thespicemanthespiceman Community champion Posts: 6,224 Disability Gamechanger
    edited November 2019
    Hello @April2018mom   You mentioned physical exercise not if it is close to bed time.

    Sorry have to tell you been to Sleep clinics and had professional medical help. 

    Reason is the mind is active and some one who used to do this. Coming home from a gym, late evening.

    Thought might help me get to sleep the mind is so over active takes ages to sleep.  Discussed this with Doctor and Mental Health support advisors in the charity I used to belong to.

    Something I would consider looking at.

    Best one of course is bedtime Olympics lol. Sorry just being a polite gentleman this time of the morning.

    As many of us are not in relationships do not have that pleasure . Lucky you if you are  lol...

    Things like housework and healthy eating contribute.

    I am not perfect have issues like every one does much education and knowledge does help.

    Got my references guides from the charities . This morning written brief notes so many pages.

    The following may be useful to all my wonderful friends and those of the community.

    Briefly

    Do not do Insomnia.

    Do not nap.

    Take Tea, Coffee or alcohol excessive amounts are stimulants close to bedtime.

    Chocolate drinks can contain cafffeine ..Caffeine is the problems.

    No smoking.

    Don't do over stimulate mind and do things like exercise, crosswords.  Or talking a heavy discussions chats .  

    Don't eat heavy, spicy foods or those with ingredients intend to repeat, containing Onions, Garlic and those junk foods.  Close to bedtime.

    Also eat a good meal but two hours before bedtime add that not go to bed with out eating.

    Don't look a the clock all the time cannot sleep get up and wander about. Have a listen to music.

    Find something relaxing anxiety worries write them down.

    Eat whole meal toast with honey, or oat biscuits.

    The one I am always doing coming on here. My excuse miss my friends . 

    I am lonely old gentleman some times on a night time.   Never used to had friendships and relationships.

    Not easy as any of us who are singletons and still a babe lol.

    Those with the following conditions sorry to say.  Anxiety, Depression, Obesity, Pain and Restless legs are going to experience sleep problems and issues.

    As I am in one of the groups my heart is for those with these problems.

    The Do's of Sleep this again briefly .

    Anxieties worries out of the bedroom, we all been there the bills, family and friends. Little things.

    Do make your bedroom comfortable a place for bedtime, sleep no TV  laptops or electrical devices.

    Mobile phones but do not use it or look at it.

    I am guilty of this but use it as emergency, have these fears, insecurities.

    Have a warm bath, meditation, hypnotherapy imagine you on a beach my one I use.

    Do get up normal time. 

    Hope that helps any one.

    Thank you.

    @thespiceman








    Community Champion
    SCOPE Volunteer Award Engaging Communities 2019
    Mental Health advice, guidance and information to all members
    Nutrition, Diet, Wellbeing, Addiction.
    Recipes
  • Tammyjane33Tammyjane33 Member, Community champion Posts: 460 Pioneering
    @OverlyAnxious hi sorry for the late reply. I suffer with insomnia too from having steroid treatment over a long period of time. I know how you feel. If you need to talk my inbox is open. 
  • chiariedschiarieds Community champion Posts: 1,705 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi everyone - I've been posting the following to someone in acute pain, so thought worth copying it here hoping it might help.
    Re-learn how to breathe like a baby. As you breathe in, let your abdomen gently rise, as you exhale you abdomen goes down again.
    This is diaphragmatic breathing, which is the correct way to breathe, & as adults we often don't do this. See: https://www.guysandstthomas.nhs.uk/resources/patient-information/therapies/abdominal-breathing.pdf
    One exercise to do at bedtime.


  • woodbinewoodbine Member Posts: 421 Pioneering
    I take 19 different tablets at bed time enough to knock a large horse out but some nights I struggle to get to sleep, so if after 20 minutes I'm not asleep I get up make myself a drink, then after about 15 minutes I go back to bed and with minutes i'm zzzzzzzz
  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Administrator Posts: 7,698 Scope community team
    Hi @Tammyjane33 (and everyone) how have you been sleeping recently?
    Community Partner
    Scope
  • mrbuttonsmrbuttons Member Posts: 220 Pioneering
    edited December 2019
    I dont sleep well at all. This week i havent fallen asleep before 6am. Then i sleep in short spells until about 4pm. When a very patient cat wakes me up to feed him.
    I take prescribed meds but they are not specifically for sleep they are anti depressants that make you sleepy and put on weight, amitrytiline ( wow insomnia and weight problems, oh the joy :'( !.)
     The only pills guarenteed to give me a good nights sleep (zopiclone) are only recommended for very, very short term use because they have been linked to early onset dementia my gp wont prescribe them any more.which i just have to accept. Its disappointing and frustrating that the things that work are illegal or unsafe.

    Im terms of alternatives, some vigarous ladies and gentlemans excercise always worked, but those days are gone.

    I have a routine. I have a warm bath with lavender oil and take my pills around 9pm i am actually in bed by 9.45 and thats when things get silly. I start feeling hungry so have to eat something but a combination of pain and anxiety stops me from sleeping. I listen to audio books or relaxing music but my brain wont switch off, even after a warm milky drink.

    There is nothing worse than being unable to sleep for long periods of time.once i went 21consecutive days without a good sleep due to stress. I was a complete wreck.
    Luckily i am not working and only myself and the cat to be responsible for so i can catch up on sleep during the day.
    Its been like this for at least 25yrs. I dont know how i was able to work full time with these sleep problems. No wonder i have chronic pain if i cant get a decent nights sleep.
  • susan48susan48 Member Posts: 2,229 Disability Gamechanger
    Sleep is a dread for me. On medication for insomnia but as I’m going through the pip journey again, it’s a nightmare. Sleeping meds at 10, 11 bed, wake at 1,3,5 then when I get up at 7 im exhausted. My mind doesn’t switch off 🤯
  • GeoarkGeoark Community champion Posts: 1,247 Disability Gamechanger
    I can normally fall asleep okay, but don't get the quality of sleep as this is apparently when my legs decide to try and run a marathon, the sleep clinic did say that while I did sleep my mind was constantly being disturbed. 

    My daughter finally decided to get herself a weighted blanket. Once she got used to the weight, a couple of evenings, she says she is finding it much easier to go to sleep and stay asleep. I am now seriously considering buying one as well.

    As an individual I stood alone.
    As a member of a group I did things.
    As part of a community I helped to create change!

  • pollyanna1052pollyanna1052 Member Posts: 1,860 Disability Gamechanger
    I did last night....chuffin back still hurting from that TOTO torture instrument! And my right foot is acting up...sore heel.....hoping my Liverpool jaunt will sort it out!
  • Kismet_anyaKismet_anya Member Posts: 12 Connected
    Yes because of chronic pain and restless legs. I can only sleep with quite a large amount of oramorph 🤦🏼‍♀️ I've struggled with sleep ever since I became mentally ill in 2015 but my anti psychotic would knock me out eventually. Now I'm better mentally it's my physical illnesses which keep me awake. I spend a lot of the night reading until I start nodding off, usually around 5 am. It's a pain in the butt not being able to sleep and my heart goes out to anyone with the same x
  • pollyanna1052pollyanna1052 Member Posts: 1,860 Disability Gamechanger
    went on tramadol yesterday...had chronic back pain for a few weeks....only woke once...4am.....
  • mrbuttonsmrbuttons Member Posts: 220 Pioneering
    Has any charity done research on the long term effects of chronic pain and sleep deprivation? So many of us live with chronic pain and lack of sleep.
  • mrbuttonsmrbuttons Member Posts: 220 Pioneering
    went on tramadol yesterday...had chronic back pain for a few weeks....only woke once...4am.....
    I hope you get on with the tramadol, pollyanna1052. its an effective pain killer but some people have mood swings on it. Wishing you another good nights sleep. :)
  • thespicemanthespiceman Community champion Posts: 6,224 Disability Gamechanger
    edited December 2019
    Hello @mrbuttons   How are you ?  All the advice I  found this on line, get a lot of members asking. Some time looking for you lovely members suffering.

    With all my heart coping with any pain or sleep issues seen so many times been through this.  Members.

    Wish I could do more. Hate to see any one in pain or having sleep problems.

    Even me has them even though I try to new meds effecting, no matter how many plans in place.

    Will this help have a look any problems come back see what I can do for you. Tag my name in, remember happy to help you know that as one of the community champions.

    Sleep in my area forget to add went to Sleep clinics in Newcastle have a look in your area might be worth looking at.

    After lifetime addiction does effect sleep.

    This is the link for chronic pain, have a look.

    https://www.awaywithpain.co.uk/

    Hope that helps, lots of support and information to trawl through on line. Just need to do some time searching for members.

    Lots in the States.

    Please take care.

    @thespiceman






    Community Champion
    SCOPE Volunteer Award Engaging Communities 2019
    Mental Health advice, guidance and information to all members
    Nutrition, Diet, Wellbeing, Addiction.
    Recipes
  • thespicemanthespiceman Community champion Posts: 6,224 Disability Gamechanger
    edited December 2019
    Hello @mrbuttons   Found this on sleep.

    https://sleepcouncil.org.uk

    For a leaflet information line only.
    800 018 7923
    Email  [email protected]

    Hope that helps

    @thespiceman
    Community Champion
    SCOPE Volunteer Award Engaging Communities 2019
    Mental Health advice, guidance and information to all members
    Nutrition, Diet, Wellbeing, Addiction.
    Recipes
  • Rifi7Rifi7 Member Posts: 163 Pioneering
    I suffer from chronic back pain and anxiety and no medication was helping and was causing side effects. Like others on this site I dread to go to bed as I can’t sleep but recently I started to try alternative ways to combat my pain and insomnia, so I’ve just recently I taking CBD oil and meditation. It’s early days but I seem to be getting more good night sleep than bad. I’m surprised more people aren’t taking CBD oil?
  • chiariedschiarieds Community champion Posts: 1,705 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi, I have osteoarthrosis in most joints, lower back & sacro-iliac problems, & neuropathic pain. Like @Rifi7 I've been taking CBD for pain (for 16 months). It keeps my lower back pain just about under control, but unfortunately it doesn't touch my neuropathic pain.
    Each night I concentrate on my breathing to aid relaxation. This is the diaphragmatic breathing I mentioned above, which, if done properly, reduces stress.
  • Rifi7Rifi7 Member Posts: 163 Pioneering
    I have been using the Linden method and also the calm app on my iPad. Where did you get diaphragmatic exercise from? Could I ask what strength CBD oil and the dosage you take?
    thank you
  • LoukasLoukas Member Posts: 2 Listener
    I have really bad insomnia and if I pass out due to exhaustion I’m such a light sleeper anything will wake me up
  • mrbuttonsmrbuttons Member Posts: 220 Pioneering
    @thespiceman
    Thanks so much i will check out the websites you have linked. Its funny i feel as if im missing out on life being awake at night and sleeping all day when everyone else is getting on with life.my sleep pattern is completely reversed. Maybe its just how my body works, been like this for deades. cant be healthy, though.our bodies need quality sleep in order to heal.
     Im not a big fan of pain killers even though i need them i would rather sleep medication because once i can sleep the pain improves.
    Thanks again for all the useful info. :)
  • chiariedschiarieds Community champion Posts: 1,705 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @Rifi7 - I used to teach relaxation exercises as a physio student, where I learnt about diaphragmatic breathing, which is what babies & young children do naturally, & adults seem to have usually lost the knack to do! I tried to explain this to someone else here who was dealing with a lot of pain, & had difficulty explaining about breathing 'wrongly' as I'm so used to breathing correctly! Here's a link to diaphragmatic breathing: https://www.guysandstthomas.nhs.uk/resources/patient-information/therapies/abdominal-breathing.pdf
    As you breathe in, let your abdomen gently fill with air & rise, as you exhale let your abdomen go down again.
    I use this oil which is one of the 'starter' oils which may help with pain due to its additional CBDa : https://www.simply-cbd.co.uk/product/simplycbd-green-10ml-30ml/ I was perhaps very fortunate to come across a facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/SimplyCBD/ which had members who knew so much about CBD. Even 'tho I'd done a fair amount of research, I didn't know which brand of CBD might work, or what dosage. They are at pains to say start with a low dosage (1 drop 3x a day for the first week; 2 drops 3x a day the 2nd week, then keep building up an additional drop 3x a day for subsequent weeks). If your symptoms worsen, then drop back down to the previous week's dosage as this is probably where you've found the best relief. They also say it can be a bit of 'trial & error' to find out what may best help any individual, & sometimes try bringing in another oil later, or try another. This seemed to be in contrast to take a strong oil, or take 15 drops a day as advocated by other companies. The company is also very ethical, & provides lab certified results as to the oils they sell. The oil I buy is only £7 a bottle + P &P. I tend to buy 3 bottles at a time. Personally I take 4 drops 3x a day, so one bottle lasts about a month, but everyone is different as to what may work for them.
    I also need to say it's very important to discuss taking CBD with a pharmacist or your GP if taking any prescribed medications. This is because over 90% of prescribed meds are broken down in your liver by a group of enzymes that also break down CBD. Therefore a 4 hour gap is recommended if taking both (& a 2 hour gap if these are 'just' over the counter meds/supplements). This is to ensure you get both the benefit of your meds (& not an accidental overdose) & also CBD.
    So many people try CBD, & find it hasn't helped, or pay way too much, sadly.



  • thespicemanthespiceman Community champion Posts: 6,224 Disability Gamechanger
    Hello @mrbuttons    Please have a look might help you those links.

    The problem are huge with sleep. Even my self may offer a lot of advice, guidance sometimes struggle to sleep.

    One of the best things is a sleep diary make after any nights rest. An evaluation of reasons why.

    One of the major concerns is certain conditions may will disrupt sleep. Including anxiety, medications, loneliness, pain and a  number of factors.

    Including diet, nutrition and well being and health.

    Eating a diet rich in vegetables, pulses beans and lean meat can induce sleep.

    Have eaten Pasta or Potatoes not near to bedtime, eat late the body is digesting food.  Makes me sleepy, no caffeine or stimulants.

    Coffee, tea, cola, chocolate, smoking, alcohol all disrupt sleep.

    Twelve hours is the maximum time for any meal to be digested so think you eat a heavy, spicy meal around nine or later, then try to go to bed will not work.

    Turn off the TV computer hard one the mobile and try to wind down.

    Meditation a good therapy a good routine useful.  

    Hope that helps the problem we all have but it can be addressed.

    Please take care.

    @thespiceman




    Community Champion
    SCOPE Volunteer Award Engaging Communities 2019
    Mental Health advice, guidance and information to all members
    Nutrition, Diet, Wellbeing, Addiction.
    Recipes
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