Hold HCP'S accountable — Scope | Disability forum
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Hold HCP'S accountable

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stejon
stejon Posts: 28 Listener
in PIP, DLA, and AA
Do you think we should grant legal aid to people who have won their tribunals? I think that if these people who were took to court under the libel law, then they would think twice about making false statements. 
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  • cristobal
    cristobal Community member Posts: 984 Disability Gamechanger
    edited January 2020
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    @stejon - I don't personally. 

    There are better things to spend the money on I think - domestic violence cases for example - rather than the " I said, she said" of a PIP assessment...

    PS It's probably a hypothetical question because legal aid is/has been cut not increased so it will never happen...




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  • Cressida
    Cressida Community member Posts: 1,018 Pioneering
    edited January 2020
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    @stejon why have you come back to bait people? Your last thread was closed. If you dont like Scopes ethos then stop posting.
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  • Cressida
    Cressida Community member Posts: 1,018 Pioneering
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    @stejan how you helping them by trying to start arguments on here? Unfortunately the nature of a discussion forum is that sometimes you don't agree with each other. But there's absolutely no need to abuse people and the whole of Scope. 
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  • cristobal
    cristobal Community member Posts: 984 Disability Gamechanger
    edited January 2020
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    "So you would rather spend money on assessments not fit for purpose and thousands of tribunals. That's not a waste of money is it? "

    @stejon - as I suspect you realise you have incorrectly summarised what I said. 

    The PIP process does have flaws - my assessment was done really badly - but I don't feel it's best to dwell on that. Anger isn't a good emotion in my opinion

    Have you got anything positive to say? Not changes to the legal aid system (which won't happen) or changing PIP (which won't happen) but advice about how to approach the assessment, how to complete the application, or how to prepare for a tribunal? Something that people applying can do right now? Something that would help?


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  • cristobal
    cristobal Community member Posts: 984 Disability Gamechanger
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    @stejon - best to leave it there I think as you don't seem to read/understand my posts...

    I'm sorry you feel so negative - hopefully one day you'll turn a corner and see that it's not the way to be...

    Good luck - I hope that things turn out OK for your friends...
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  • cristobal
    cristobal Community member Posts: 984 Disability Gamechanger
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    @stejon - well done...

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  • FionaMay
    FionaMay Community member Posts: 7 Courageous
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    Hi, I am a long-term lurker but only joined a few days ago.  This isn’t what I signed up to post about but I would say there is a discussion to be had about HCPs here. 

    The number of reports which contain errors/mistakes/falsehoods seems to be quite substantial and most of the time no-one is held accountable.  If a complaint is made to IAS they either insist the Assessor is accurate or cannot remember.  The independent case examiner (ICE) is overwhelmed and the backlog is daunting, you are likely to get a date for the Tribunal before the complaint is looked at. This is not acceptable. 

    The DM is still likely to take the point scores as their primary guide instead of just one piece of evidence as the second independent review recommended.   https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/604097/pip-assessment-second-independent-review.pdf

    I have seen it stated on here that it isn’t a medical report as such, that it is some kind of observational opinion.  This would possibly be okay if it was accurate and subject to independent scrutiny as a matter of routine, but it is not. 

    Just to give a personal example, my sister had an assessment and the report said her daughter answered the door, it was actually our 6’2” brother who did that. It went on to state that she was “well-kempt” and made good eye contact even though she was on intravenous morphine and was unconscious throughout the visit.  She scored 0 points on both parts.  While this kind of thing continues to happen the system is failing everyone because the award is conditional not on how your disability affects you, but on whether the Assessor submits an honest report.


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  • Adrian_Scope
    Adrian_Scope Posts: 11,011 Scope online community team
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    Hi @stejon. 
    I'm sorry to read about the PIP experiences you've described and wish the people you're helping all the best. If you have any questions or need help with the appeals please don't hesitate to create a new thread and I'm certain you'll receive lots of support and advice.

    I think almost everyone agrees the assessment process is not fit for purpose, but our members mostly try to focus on helping guide each other through it by explaining the descriptors etc rather than focusing energy on complaining about the HCPs or fighting with each other. 

    I'd also like to remind you of our community guidelines, in particular the following: 

    Community house rules

    Scope's online community is for anyone with an interest in disability. We hope it will be a useful place to share information and ideas.

    The community is not intended as a source of professional or medical advice and support. The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect Scope's opinions.

    Keep it friendly

    We want the community to be a safe and supportive place. Please make sure your messages respect other users’ views and suggestions, even if you do not agree with them.

    Take care to present your views tactfully and remember that humour may be misinterpreted.

    Keep it safe

    Please be careful about sharing information:

    • Always check that information you get is correct and appropriate.
    • Do not present opinions as facts.
    • Share only trusted resources.
    Community Manager
    Scope
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  • cristobal
    cristobal Community member Posts: 984 Disability Gamechanger
    edited January 2020
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    @Fionamay - as you say there are problems with some of the assessments and I'm sorry to hear about your sister. Mine wasn't done well either.

    Have I read this correctly - your sister was unconscious and yet the assessment went ahead?

    Clearly this is very serious - have you raised this with anyone?

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  • FionaMay
    FionaMay Community member Posts: 7 Courageous
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    @cristobal -Yes, that is exactly what happened.  My sister had an appointment with her Cancer specialist a couple of days after she got the decision letter, he got the DWP on the phone, gave them an earful and followed it up with a letter.  The decision was reversed within a week.  
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  • Adrian_Scope
    Adrian_Scope Posts: 11,011 Scope online community team
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    Hi @FionaMay and a warm welcome to the community. Sorry I didn't spot your post before I submitted mine.

    I'm really sorry to read about your sister's experience and thank you for taking the time to share it with us. Has she since been awarded or did you have to appeal? Please let us know if there's anything we can help you with. 
    Community Manager
    Scope
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  • FionaMay
    FionaMay Community member Posts: 7 Courageous
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    Adrian_Scope said:
    Hi @FionaMay and a warm welcome to the community. Sorry I didn't spot your post before I submitted mine.

    I'm really sorry to read about your sister's experience and thank you for taking the time to share it with us. Has she since been awarded or did you have to appeal? Please let us know if there's anything we can help you with. 
    Yes, she was awarded it soon after her specialist contacted them.  It was two years ago so I cannot remember if there was an actual MR request, I think they just sent out a new letter saying they could award her.
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