PIP, DLA and AA
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MR and no PIP

Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
edited October 2017 in PIP, DLA and AA
Hi there eventually have got so desperate for advice as a parent of son 28 who is add that I came upon your site ....just had a mandatory consideration appeal letter stating no pip for my son....having addressed each statement and included letters from current mental health psych he is seeing I am at a loss where to go now...my son will lose housing benefit and be unable to live ...he has thoughts of taking his life and I am trying to support him through a really bad time ..anyone offer advice please 

Replies

  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Sorry he is high functioning autism and has adhd ...
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Community champion Posts: 5,256 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi Tracy and welcome

    So sorry you are having to go through this with your son
    It is not unusual for MR to return unchanged
    You now have two choices
    1) Appeal to the tribunal. this is an independant panel that will look at all the evidence without the bias of the DWP
    2) As your son has no award in payment you can make a fresh claim

    There is plenty of info on here and the CAB site about the appeal process, have a look round and come back with any questions

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Hi thank you for replying i feel very alone at present.i have been reading everyone's discussions and not sure where I am as i had asked for mandatory reconsideration and yesterday received a letter that has stated no entitlement to pips even tho standard before from  pips interview..i have been awaiting a tribunal interview ...should I phone Dwp and tribunal services to ask what is happening ? Can you give me some idea of who to talk too for help...my son is today very angry and upset and I am really concerned about his well being.We are under mental health team but he can't deal with appointments and changes to his day already... these affect him greatly...if he loses pip altogether I can't afford his flat this will send him off into great despair and anger and i can't even imagine how he will be ...is there a professional service I can access to support me to fight for what is not a great quality of life but without the benefits he can't even exist regards tracy
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Community champion Posts: 5,256 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi Tracy
    You are not alone we are here to help, support and listen any way we can.
    If you have already made an appeal to the tribunal the yous should ring the tribunal  clerk who should be able to tell you the waiting time. They may also be able to get you an early hearing on hardship grounds.
    Have you Tried the CAB for assistance ?
    You can also ring the Scope help line above
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Hi thank you for your return email
    I have rang the tribunal clerk and she has advised me to write a further statement that reflects all the issues etc that may explain my son and how this reflects on family etc....i spent hours writing the appeal ,yet i think on my own i am possibly so used to our 'norm' that i dont even see the things that i should be writing ...
    I then spoke to the mental health team, as my son is awaiting a ASD specialist in Dudley appointment and she recommended i ring the gp and follow this up...I then spoke to the surgery re appointment and have to go in tomorrow morning for 8.30 to make an appointment to see the Gp ,who can advise me as to the situation for ASD specialist appointment !! I am trying to work, do all this and try to look after my son who is having constant meltdowns and struggling so badly
    I am only 5 weeks in waiting for tribuanl and its 23 weeks apparrently to being heard by the tribunal .Im not sure we will survive that long my money is running out and my mental health is deteriorating rapdily let alone the dehabilitating effect upon my son,partner and other children ....If i ring Scope would they be able to offer constructive advice as to writing a statement .I feel like i will inplode soon  regards tracy




  • Sam_ScopeSam_Scope Member Posts: 7,732 Disability Gamechanger
    Sorry you are having such a difficult time @Tracey1962

    Scope
    Senior online community officer
  • MatildaMatilda Member Posts: 2,616 Disability Gamechanger
    @Tracy1962

    Scope helpline might be able to advise you about face to face help in your area.
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering

    Hi @Tracy1962

    OK - a couple of things to consider - Firstly, clearly the loss of the PIP is causing financial hardship to your son and yourself, and I can't quite figure this out - has his Housing Benefit been reduced as a result of the PIP decision? Do you know the reason for this? As there are only limited circumstances in which this should happen, and there may be ways to combat this while the appeal is pending.

    Let us know what is going on with the housing benefit and we may be able to advise on this.

    Secondly - the statement - don't get too worked up about this, just check the DWP bundle to make sure all the medical evidence you submitted to them is in it, and if it is not, send copies of the evidence direct to the Tribunals Service. There is no harm in writing a statement - but if you're worried about tripping yourself up, because you are so used to the ways you cope, then don't do one, it won't harm the case.

    MAKE SURE YOU HAVE REQUESTED AN ORAL HEARING FOR THE TRIBUNAL and if you haven't, then call them now and ask to change it. This is often the main factor in winning appeals, as the claimant themselves is the best evidence to present to the Tribunal.

    Have a look at the Citizens Advice guides to PIP tribunals, they're quite comprehensive https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/appeals/apply-to-tribunal/

    Hope this helps, but do let us know if you need anything further.

    Kind regards,

    Mary

    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thank you Mary..last time they stopped his pips his housing for single occupancy was stopped and his benefit until a decision was made then he only received standard pip and now they have said in letter only 6 points he won't get any so his housing also will drop....we have over 19 weeks to go and everything is falling apart..the worsening of his mental state is the most worrying he perceives losing his flat and especially his car this was where he lived for months until I managed to get him back on track five years ago ....i will contact tribunal and ask for oral hearing...regards tracy
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Hi Tracy,

    Does your son rent privately? If so, it sounds as if without PIP your son's housing benefit would be limited to what they call the shared room rate, and that is what causes the drop. It's also possible that the way housing benefit is calculated would be affected by the loss of PIP, but that depends on whether he also gets any other, income-based benefits. Please ask the local authority for discretionary housing payments as soon as possible. These are extra payments they can make to help someone who gets some housing benefit, but not enough to pay the rent - they are discretionary, and no everyone who applies will get them, but I think your son has a very good case that they should be paid.

    As you mention Dudley, I wonder if you are in Sandwell and Dudley local authority? They have a welfare rights team who might be able to help you prepare for the appeal. I agree with all Mary's advice and it's true that you don't have to write a statement for the tribunal if you're worried - it's still possible to win without one. But you could consider getting local, professional help so that some of the stress is taken off you. 

    If you haven't already done it, take the PIP self-test (either with your son, or answering as if for him) to see what he should have scored. And don't worry too much about the MR - they are usually refused, it doesn't mean you don't have a a good case, I am sure that you do.

    You mention his car - if this is a Motability vehicle, I would get in touch with them  I'm not sure whether any help is available in your son's situation to help him to keep his car whilst waiting for the appeal, but it is worth asking.

    Will
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    PS Tracy1962,

    I would consider contacting your MP about this too, given all the stress and worry this is causing your son. It's important MPs are aware of how reassessments and their outcomes can completely disrupt a vulnerable person's income and living situation. We need to press for an end to resasessments for someone in your son's position.

    Will
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thank you so much for your advice i will do what i can ...i feel demotivated at the moment think coping with him and the DWP and now just had the esa needing to be completed for an assessment so really struggling on my own 
    but he has no one else to be his support, so i need to buck up and plough on 
    kind regards Tracy
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Tracy1962Tracy1962,

    Oh Tracy, I'm sorry - it's hard enough and then getting an ESA reassessment too. One thing about ESA though - since the autumn they've said that people with ongoing conditions who won't ever be expected to work should get told after the assessment whether they will be assessed again. So, fingers crossed, if this system actually works (!) then after this assessment at least your son shouldn't be reassessed for ESA in the future. We don't know for certain though how well this will work, and I do worry that they may limit it to people with physical disabilities  - this would be another thing worth raising with your MP if your son doesn't get a decision that this will be his last ESA assessment. 

    I really hope that a similar system will eventually apply to PIP too so that you and your son don't have to go through all this again!

    Thank you - I hope you get some motivation from the forum. There are lots of people here with experience of the system ready to give info and support. 
    Good luck Tracy.

    Will
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    This week I have contacted tribunal clerk who advised sending urgent appointment for tribunal hearing ...i asked for oral appeal as you advised..i have written short statement to the judge key points in...contacted MIND,tried "CAB six times waiting 15 mins before I gave up each time...attended mental health appointment with son ...listened to doctors lack of Asd knowledge ....who wants to prescribe anti depressants to son...phonef GP to discuss asd referral ...phoned and emailed local MP ....contacted housing 're loss of benefit ...phoned DWP to ask about benefit stopped and spoke to a decision maker who couldn't explain the decision made ....in between I have cared for my son and tried to reassure him he will be ok ...i also worked and looked after family as well as i could...i have been offered no support although often asked for it..and still I have to manage ..is a fair system hmm?
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Hi Tracy1962,

    I work for the Welfare Rights team at Sandwell Council. Do you live in Sandwell or is your GP surgery in Sandwell? If so, please let me know on here. 

    Lee
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Hi Lee
    unfortunately my son is based in rugeley ...we are meant to be referred to dudley ASD clinic as this county doesnt have specialist service. My son is being rehoused by myself iwithn East staffordshire from 3rd of december as he has terrible noise and problems with the people in other flats.
    Can you still advise would really appreciate what i can do 
    regards Tracy
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Tracy1962, as regards local support we wouldn't necessarily know. You can try asking the Scope helpline if there is a local disability information service near you. Some local authorities have a welfare rights service, but as far as I can see East Staffs does not - no harm in contacting them to check though.

    I would just repeat what my colleague Mary has said above. You do not necessarily need a representative to get the right result at the hearing. You don't even need to write a detailed submission. You have already drafted a statement of key points, which sounds great. Any evidence you can submit between now and the hearing date is helpful - & if you do submit further evidence, it is worth copying it to the DWP (even though the tribunal will do this) and ringing them, just in case you can get a changed decision without a hearing.

    Hopefully you will get the report from the ASD specialist in Dudley before the hearing date; if you don't, it may be worth asking the tribunal to postpone the hearing until you have this (I can't guarantee that they will postpone, but it is worth asking).

    Unfortunately it is the case that in some areas there is very little support for these circumstances, or just not enough for the number of people who need it. This is another reason why I'd recommend going to your MP and trying to get help from the constituency surgery. Outline all the consequences this is having for your son.

    Meanwhile, as Mary has pointed out, it is the claimant's oral evidence that can make the biggest difference at the hearing. So you can talk to your son about this. The tribunal is independent of the DWP. There will be a medically qualified member, the judge, and another member with experience of disability (either as a disabled person or from working with disabled people). It might be helpful to have a chat to your son and explain the role of the tribunal - they genuinely are there to get the legally correct result and see that the interests of justice are served.

    The tribunal will also be aware that there is much less help available to people, and many more people needing advice, so they tend to be supportive of unrepresented claimants and will explain the process as clearly as they can. 

    You should mention in your statement to the tribunal that you rang the DWP (give the date and any other details) and that they couldn't explain the decision. That will help your case, I think.

    I'm so sorry that there isn't more support out there. Your MP may be interested - I really hope that they are, and that they can help you, as I know you have asked for support several times. Everyone on here will offer as much support and advice as they can meanwhile.

    Will
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • Tracy1962Tracy1962 Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thank you Will i appreciate your reply and will use the advice ...i am about to fill in the ESA form now this seems very similar and greatly concerned if they also decide he isn't entitled to benefit ...this would leave us in a real mess ...what do you have to do to get entitlement .i was told by CAB that I am ideal person for DWP as i do everything for my son .does this mean let him sink so low social services pick him up and sort it?we live in a very sad times if vulnerable people have this type of life 
    Tracy
  • Pippa_ScopePippa_Scope Member Posts: 5,856 Disability Gamechanger
    Best of luck with your application @Tracy1962, I really hope you get the outcome you're hoping for.
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