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Qualifying for contribution based ESA

dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener
Having just spoken to the NI office and reading out the official criteria from Scope web page. I feel I need to explain what they have told me.

Class 1 or 2 NI contributions protect  the individual  and allow individuals to claim for contribution based ESA. Class 1 and 2 is equal to the low earnings limit. 

ESA contribution based precondition 1 is erroneous . The 2nd precondition is that for each of the previous 2 tax years to the tax year in which your claiming, you must have paid or been credited with class 1 or 2 NI for 50 weeks . You can pay retrospectively in certain instances for up to the previous 6 years 

The 1st precondition is met by the 2nd precondition (above) as the second precondition is for 50 weeks each year. This 1st condition is strange and unnecessary.

Class 1 and 2 tax is equal to low earnings limit so the blaablaa about low earnings is completely unnecessary and confusing . 

MOST IMPORTANTLY . 
PAYING CLASS 2 NI AS YOU GO ALONG OR RETROSPECTIVELY DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE TO HAVE WORKED. (The preconditions quoted by entitledto website it says paying class 2 means you've had to have worked is simply wrong...this is not true) see below

 You can pay voluntary contributions for class 2 retrospectively  if you meet just 1 of the following criteria.

You work self employed
You work overseas
You rent out property whether you work or not 
You have other income such as a company pension. Whether you work or not

I respectfully request that the administrators please check out my findings and advise if they feel any of my information is incorrect. If they find it is correct, then the Scope advice page detailing  eligibility for claiming ESA contribution based allowance needs to be amended.  I have already written to both CAB and Entitledto. I feel it is important that we dont just keep copy and pasting and sharing confusing and incorrect information because its written on a website.  

Thank you for reading 


Replies

  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Posts: 1,368Member Chatterbox
    Thank you so much for updating us on this @dunnesy :)
  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener
    Hi Chloe. I'm concerned because criteria information showing  on all the respected sites including Scope  seems to be wrong. This could result in people who are entitled to claim thinking they dont meet the criteria. For me personally its been a frustrating and distressing experience. As an organisation you have many more contacts and more power to speak to the BA and get clear and simple precondition information and amend your page. I am asking if you can take the time to do this?  
    Its a terrible thought that if even just 1 person didn't claim because they thought they couldn't ....any info on criteria needs to be correct and worded appropriately so the reader can understand .
    Thanks
  • Sam_ScopeSam_Scope Posts: 7,153Administrator Scope community team
    I will pass this on @dunnesy and ask someone to look into it.

    @BenefitsTrainingCo could you clarify please?
    Scope
    Senior online community officer
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Posts: 2,589Member, Community advisor Chatterbox

    I don't know which part of the scope website you are referring to. But I have looked at the entitledto website which appears to me to be correct.

    There is a distinction between paying national insurance contributions and being credited with contributions. In practice this means you must have worked in at least 26 weeks of the two years before the year in which you claim with earnings of at least the lower earnings level, whilst you must also have either paid or been credited with contributions in at least 50 weeks of both of the two years before the year in which you claim.

    The way I approach this is to consider that someone is unlikely to qualify for contributory ESA if they have done no work at all in either of the two years before the year in which they claim. But if someone has done at least some work in either of those years they may well qualify.

    I appreciate these rules are very technical and can cause confusion. I hope this helps.

    David
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 8,212Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    I totally agree with benefitsTraining Co,

    I see absolutely nothing incorrect about any of the websites stating the conditions for claiming a Contribution based benefit.

    @dunnesy and based on your circumtances was your ESA CB claim successful? I'd be interested to know if it was or not.
  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener
    • From CAB
    • you’ve paid at least 26 weeks class 1 or class 2 National Insurance (NI) contributions in one of the last 2 complete tax years and have been paid or credited with NI contributions for at least 50 weeks in each of the last 2 complete tax years. The 2 tax years must be the ones that were completed before the benefit year in which your period of limited capability for work began. The benefit year runs from the first Sunday in January. The tax year runs from 6 April to 5 April. You can check your national insurance record online 
  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener

    From the NI website.

    National Insurance contributions count towards the benefits and pensions in the table.

    BenefitClass 1: employeesClass 2: self-employedClass 3: voluntary contributions
    Basic State PensionYesYesYes
    Additional State PensionYesNoNo
    New State PensionYesYesYes
    Contribution-based Jobseeker’s AllowanceYesNoNo
    Contribution-based Employment and Support AllowanceYesYesNo
    Maternity AllowanceYesYesNo
    Bereavement Support PaymentYesYesNo

    Class 4 contributions paid by self-employed people with a profit over £8,424 do not usually count towards state benefits.

  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener
    Please can you provide evidence apart from entitledto website about working for 26 weeks. no one else has details of having to work 26 weeks . not CAB or even gov.org 
    The NI office whom, by the way, the benefits helpline told me to call have assured me that class 2 retrospective payments qualify to make a  claim for contributory ESA as it is clearly set out in their chart. That's good enough for me . 
  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener

    Contributory ESA

    You may be able to claim contributory ESA if:you’re not in a Universal Credit full service areayou’ve paid enough National Insurance contributions (National Insurance credits can count for part of this, if you get them)

  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener

    I don't know which part of the scope website you are referring to. But I have looked at the entitledto website which appears to me to be correct.

    There is a distinction between paying national insurance contributions and being credited with contributions. In practice this means you must have worked in at least 26 weeks of the two years before the year in which you claim with earnings of at least the lower earnings level, whilst you must also have either paid or been credited with contributions in at least 50 weeks of both of the two years before the year in which you claim.

    The way I approach this is to consider that someone is unlikely to qualify for contributory ESA if they have done no work at all in either of the two years before the year in which they claim. But if someone has done at least some work in either of those years they may well qualify.

    I appreciate these rules are very technical and can cause confusion. I hope this helps.

    David
    Thanks David but could you just glance over my other posts and I think you might revise your thinking. 
  • dunnesydunnesy Posts: 19Member Listener
    By the way David you pay national insurance class 2 if your self employed, renting a home, working abroad or have other income such a works pension . you can pay class 2 for all these things, you don't just have to be self employed. Paying is paying no matter why or who pays and as you know class 2 can only be paid by an individual, mostly those self employed . The confusion has arisen because of the " this means you have to be working" section of entitledto page which is not born out by the NI rules or the government website or our conversation with DWP. If there is any other information that disputes this please advise. We have suffered more than 5  hours of Vivaldi to clarify this
    We wish you well
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Posts: 8,212Member, Community champion Brian Blessed
    Was your ESA claim successful?
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